Chapter 37-2- Balance of Power

[pmchawk]

It was disc 2 that was missing. That's: Homecoming, Band Candy, Revelations, and Lover's Walk. Not much to analyze there...well Lover's Walk fits, but I'm gonna call it coincidence.

I would think "revelations" could have been the clue that Micheal was about to year a revaluation about angel. Also wasnt there a character in Buffy called angel?

[EpiEpee]

I would think "revelations" could have been the clue that Micheal was about to year a revaluation about angel. Also wasnt there a character in Buffy called angel?

There was a character in Buffy called Angel- a dark, brooding vampire. He was also trying to escape the vampire family and live without human blood, leading to some possible parallels to WA Angel.

Thought about putting a spoilers tag on the Buffy info, but I feel as though since the series is finished that it wasn't really necessary.

[scbubba]

Listened to 37-2 again (of course), especially the confrontation between Michael and Victor. I'm still not exactly sure what Victor's angle on the whole thing is. If he is going after a power play, he's not going to do well as he is pretty culpable in the whole "disarming the Colony" thing (reference Glenn and Pete's accusations near the end of last season).

Vic does sound like he may be trying to shift real blame away from himself for the actions that night they fled the Colony. Almost like he's trying to make it so that what Vic did wouldn't have been bad except for Michael's involvement. Not sure if this is a personal guilt thing for him or an attempt to do some political maneuvering.

Either way, we end up with a heated confrontation between Michael and Victor right about the time that the Angel execution video is discovered. So there's a chance the whole purpose was to raise the tension between the two of them so that tinderbox would ignite.

Couple of other things I noticed that may or may not play into the Balance of Power:
- Michael mentions "my soldiers" in the descriptions after the surgery. Paired with Puck's "Hey Bossman" this puts the Fort Irwin guys squarely in his camp. No surprise there.
- The way Michael says "CJ survived" after the surgery scene tripped a thought in my brain that maybe all will not be well with CJ post-surgery. I'm sure that she will have some emotional/psych things to deal with. I can't imagine what losing a leg would do to someone, especially someone who fights to be so self-sufficient. The ominous feeling from Michael saying that line leads me to perhaps an issue of mental/intellectual function based on the homemade chloroform. This could lead to animosity between CJ and Michael as opposed to the perfect marriage of planning and execution most of us expect....

Lizzie
She knows about Angel. She's the one who talked Bricks into showing the video to Durai. Why is she still silent on the issue? Because Victor shushed her several days ago? Has she even told Saul yet? If so, why hasn't Saul told Michael or Burt? This makes me wonder about the potential division this might led to once it's known that she knew and didn't say anything...

Oh man, can't wait for Monday to roll around....

[PencilBoy99]

I loathe Pegs now. She has a right not to be into Michael, but she was surprisingly cruel to him. The scene was really well done.

[UndeadSweeper]

So is everything going to be blame on Michael then (relationships, disarmament, Maller, the revolution, Sean and Angel and healthcare) ? Or will the colony need to hold some of the blame as well ( They created gatekeeper, allow people to shot dead at the gate and keeping a class system, Sean being killed and turn a blind eye to the problems they created) ?

[pmchawk]

I really don't think Victor is playing any political game. I think he is advising Micheal not to "take power" because the colony will reject him and likely turn on all of the "outsiders". And likely kick them out as if they are a cancer. When they see him they will think of everything that happened because he showed up at the door. I think CJ is the only outsider they would accept as a leader. She would be viewed as a liberator.

[Th3_T3ch]

So this is something I didn't really think of until about my third listen through. Besides Saul, Riley, and Tanya, Michael has known his soldiers longer than any other main characters. Meaning Puck cares more about Michael then Saul would. Saul and Victor are closer than Saul and Michael. I'm seeing some future conflict between Saul and Puck (other than the fact that both of them in the same room leads to some interesting conversations, and potentially hilarious ones too).
As much as people are bashing on Pegs for being hard to Michael, she has a point. Her and Michael were an end of the world get with someone thing, were Pegs and Boulder-guy could actually find things they had in common. Plus all the time her and Michael were together they were fighting for their lives, not really focused on the fact that they didn't have much in common.
As for Saul and CJ, they've been in the same group for five months. The banter before the operation starts is one that comes from reliance on each other that was formed from months of surviving together. I'm sure if Victor was there instead of Saul the banter would have been only slightly less intense.

[Witch_Doctor]

So this is something I didn't really think of until about my third listen through. Besides Saul, Riley, and Tanya, Michael has known his soldiers longer than any other main characters. Meaning Puck cares more about Michael then Saul would. Saul and Victor are closer than Saul and Michael. I'm seeing some future conflict between Saul and Puck (other than the fact that both of them in the same room leads to some interesting conversations, and potentially hilarious ones too).
As much as people are bashing on Pegs for being hard to Michael, she has a point. Her and Michael were an end of the world get with someone thing, were Pegs and Boulder-guy could actually find things they had in common. Plus all the time her and Michael were together they were fighting for their lives, not really focused on the fact that they didn't have much in common.
As for Saul and CJ, they've been in the same group for five months. The banter before the operation starts is one that comes from reliance on each other that was formed from months of surviving together. I'm sure if Victor was there instead of Saul the banter would have been only slightly less intense.

Yep, the relationship dynamics seem like they should be different now. Some were built during short and intense situations, others during length of time together and others with different opportunities to grow.

Also, I like your name for Peg's unnamed boyfriend, Boulder-guy. I wonder if there really is a Boulder-guy. Reminds me of the 'girlfriends' my nerdy friends and I would make up so neither of us could tease each other for being virgins.
"Yeah, I DID have sex before."
"Really? With who?"
"Uh, Tootie."
"The girl from Facts of Life? Nah uh! You're lying."
"Not THAT Tootie, you dork! My girlfriend Tootie.... Frutay. You don't know her, she lives in Canada."

[Arch_Will]

"Yeah, I DID have sex before."
"Really? With who?"
"Uh, Tootie."
"The girl from Facts of Life? Nah uh! You're lying."
"Not THAT Tootie, you dork! My girlfriend Tootie.... Frutay. You don't know her, she lives in Canada."

I think i know her... Tootie Frutay... doesn't she live ... on Route A .... somewhere?

[Hoff4D]

Alright, I was on vacation and had to sift through all this to try and coherently formulate some thoughts.....here we go, pardon the length please:

Watch out now....Victor and Pegs characters are taking the turn into gaining depth. That means these loveable characters are going to gain a nastier edge we may not like as listeners. Especially Victor.

I thought the same thing when I listened "Oh hey...Pegs and Victor are about to get interesting". Now that I think about the tape finding, and the revenge towards Pegs, I feel like we're being built up to push us away from pegs as she pulls a martyr move in the Scratch storyline. Pegs will grow thicker skin, and do more 'greater good' moves, but so cold that we like her for what she does, but hate her attitude. Thus we are hurt when she falls on scratches blade, but can understand her motives. I could be way off, but it just felt that way to me.

I went back to listen to when Michael finally finds pegs/kelly to see if she seemed distant there as well, because this scene in 37-2 seemed so out of the blue, I didnt recall any cold shoulder from her when he found her/kelly at Irwin. Looking back through Ch 36, pegs seemed infatuated once again at first "oh my gosh, you're good.....you're good". I heard that as "oh michael I've missed you so much! but.....oh yea....i committed to moving on...so yea, you're good". We have some banter from Michael stating how many times he looked for her in the incoming people, and she sounds heartwarmed about it saying "Really??". Fast forward a few minutes and you hear pegs say "at least I'm not flying"...but once we get on the helicopter, as soon as Michael says "hey pegs!", she walked up to the controls to give a hand flying, and didnt even acknowledge Michael addressing her. She admits she didnt want to fly, but as soon as Michael wants to talk, she bails. Unless I'm hearing it wrong and Michael was calling out FOR her to co-pilot, this is a great testament to Kc's writing.

I think these are the emotions one would honestly go thru. She HAD feelings for him, and was excited to see him alive, but immediately remembered that it's just not right for them to continue on like nothing changed. Just a tip of the hat

I am having a hard time imagining what kind of objections the colonists could have against Michael. I mean, how are they going to phrase it? "You should have let us kill you, instead you fought your way out to survive!!! You're a HORRIBLE PERSON!!1!11".....

I'm wondering why all we are hearing is Victors warning of the Colonists, yet no actual grumblings from colonists. I see several people think Victor is setting up his own leadership, but I doubt that. I THINK it just might be for the sake of time and to not give more characterization that we just hear the colonists complaints through Victor. Although, it wouldn't hurt to give John Smith and Jane Doe a couple "What about how he screwed us!" "Yea, he's the reason we're in this mess!" lines....but that just might be held off for when Michael calls some sort of town-hall meeting in 37-3 or later. I think we're all just running too far with the Victor divide against 'michaels men'. Unless Saul bails on Michaels comman, I don't think Victor will.

You can see how the average Colonist that's been there the whole time could easily be convinced by someone (like Victor maybe) that Michael doesn't have their best interests at heart. Is it a powerplay by Victor to take a spot at the Colony? Sure he says that he wasn't well liked around there but we don't really know that....

To add to my above comments about Vic(ky), I think we have plenty to go on that he wasn't "well liked" in the colony. He was sitting alone at the bar amongst other relatively high ranking colonist men, his claims to kelly (albeit they were his own) about "i never really picked a side" in the colony when the overthrow was about to happen. He made the comment so quickly in the heat of the moment I find it hard to make that lie up since he fully intended to free Michael from that point, also the little safe house him and Fernando made? They set it up to play soccer, together, alone. All these points add up to a loner type. Not necessarily hated, just not in the favor of all. He says at the bar how he worked to just get a job outside the walls. He was neither here nor there with chain of command, he just wanted to live and others to live.....no leadership aspiration (in my eyes), so I think this too adds that he doesn't have political motives along with not being in the good graces of the people of the colony

As long as I am defending Michael, I am not sure if he was actually using the chloroform. Since Saul was so clueless, my guess is Michael may have been doing it in his first tour when he was hard charging. They may have been using it in abductions and interrogations.

If you listen to Michael's first response to Saul, he almost sounds proud of his 'old days'. the way he said "Two guys I shared a tend with" he sounds like he's bragging of how much they used to party. But when saul gets apprehensive like "They were getting HIGH?!", Michael begins to back down and plays the 'it was fun to make" and "It's a good thing I did those things!" role. I honestly think Michael was just partying, not interrogating.


Alright, away from the replies I wanted to give, I also wanted to note that we addressed the safe house theory. Saul brings up to CJ before the surgery all her safe houses and her preparedness. I think this lends itself to the spread out to attack theory...then once CJ comes too we will start using her setup to gain intel/attack Ink et al. Will it be because the Colony has a falling out with Michael and we need to split up? Who knows, but it's possible given the foreshadowing. Perhaps it's CJ's idea once she can think things through again and the colony falls in line behind her. She recognizes Michael's usefulness and agrees to let him head up a certain faction. She plays the 'michael is stupid' role to the colony, but behind the scenes works in perfect synchronicity with him. This is contrary to my above comments on Pegs, but if she's not the martyr type, maybe the CJ chemistry makes her jealous enough to start seeking out Michael again?

About the video of Angel's death, SOMEONE has to make an effort to tell Riley, because it's still just a tape. If we DONT want her to see it, destroy the tape, there is NO reason to keep it around otherwise. If we want her to see it, we show her. Although it's possible a month after the tape is destroyed someone slips and mentions the death, but still....that potential BOMB of a tape sitting around is just plain NOT a good idea, there is absolutely no good outcome to keeping it in tact.

To add to this, I think we find more things searching through mallers stuff. Perhaps the mallers had an offensive plan for attacking the zeds? Perhaps it wasn't the worst plan and we adopt it? Or we need Tardusts bomb specialties and seek him out to help us attack the zeds? Our hands, his brains....all for a trade of peace? Being that only a few mallers are left they'd have to agree. Of course, this would give scratch a perfect opportunity to get close to pegs and kill her.


........This would also set us up (within the given narrative of storytelling) for a perfect scene of someone witnessing Scratch go mentally insane when she comes face to face with Ink only to realize he's the guy who raped her, and she saves humanity in a fit of rage