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  1. #121
    YetAnotherBloodyCheek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch View Post
    Hey Liam,

    Thanks for the thoughtful analysis. Here’s a little bit of my thought process, keeping in mind that the bottom line here is that your guess is as good as mine.



    There’s a certain cold-blooded logic to the concept of having the civilians shelter in place, and it isn’t necessarily to keep them safe.

    First, it gets the civilians off the streets, where they’re easy targets for the zombies to turn and recruit. During the initial outbreak there were large, panicked crowds on the streets that provided rapid, massive reinforcement for the zombies and allowed them to spread rapidly in overwhelming numbers.

    Second, it forces the zombies to spend extra time breaking into individual houses to find humans to turn. This means they’re “recruiting†in ones or twos, and they’re taking losses doing it. The zombies lose momentum, their progress slows and the troops won’t have to face as many.

    Third, it makes it easier and safer for the troops who respond. The greatest advantage the human troops have is their ability to kill zombies at a distance, before the zombies can get close enough to kill or turn them. With the civilians indoors the troops are free to shoot anything they encounter, shooting first and asking questions later.



    We know the Little Ones/Inklings/Soldier Zombies are faster, stronger, tougher and craftier than the standard biters, and we suspect that they may retain some knowledge from their past life. But what we’ve seen so far of their actions in Boulder don’t strike me as being dramatically different from what we saw from normal biters during the initial outbreak. How much of their attack is thought out on the spot, and how much follows a pre-programmed script? My thought is that they’re doing the same thing biters would have, just faster and more efficiently.

    We don’t know that they’d have the same response to the sweat bottles that the normal biters do, but there’s no reason to think they wouldn’t. It’s worth a try, and if the sweat doesn’t do the trick there are other ways to lure a mass of Inklings into kill-zones. Of course, with the Inklings there’s a good chance that tricks won’t work more than once, so the Army is going to have to make it count.
    Great analysis, Cabbage. I'm just wondering if it is feasible for the army teams to retake Boulder. I am no military man, but the conditions seem to be quite unfavorably: house-to-house-fighting, the weather conditions, zombified soldiers. Considering the "cellular armor" capabilities of this advanced kind of zombies, how many FN Scar / M16 rounds does it take, to bring a zombie down? Ok, only one cardridge if you are lucky enough, I know. Not matter which side will win in the end, there will be a massive blood shed.

  2. #122
    LiamKerrington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fridginators View Post
    Witch Doctor also needs to stop making such good posts. I can't give him any more rep.
    +1
    Zombie Story:
    - raises the acceptance of killing humans in huge numbers,
    - reveals everything bad and and even worse about human behaviour and psychology,
    - is fun.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch View Post
    • The trick now will be to draw the Inklings into the open, where they can be effectively engaged by any available armor, artillery and helicopter gunships. This becomes particularly attractive if there is an MLRS unit in Boulder. Imagine the KODI, but on a grand scale.
    Using an MLRS in Boulder would be bad for the city. Can you imagine multiple rockets pounding the city? You'd have civilians getting whacked left and right, building collapsing, it would be havoc.

    As to the civies hiding out with guns... I think I like this idea. Colorado is a huge hunting state with 1000's of gun owners, and more then likely 100000's of rounds at their disposal. I think in a SHTF kind of world the military would be looking for some help draft/militia style.

  4. #124
    Witch_Doctor's Avatar
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    Cabbage Patch and LiamKerrington, you guys are on a roll.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch View Post
    Assuming the humans don't panic, the situation in Boulder should start to stabilize.

    • The population is locked up tight in boarded up homes and fortified public buildings, and they're armed. This means that the Inklings will have a tougher time recruiting than was the case during the initial outbreak and they're taking losses doing it. And don't forget, Datu is at large, with a pickaxe!

    • Army units that were guarding the perimeter of the city will be reorganizing and converging on the city center. With the civilians indoors, anyone seen on the streets will be a target, allowing the troops to make maximum use of their firepower and making it much harder for the Inklings to turn the troops. This should slow the outward spread of the Inklings, and possibly start pushing them back. The assault force from Fort Irwin should arrive in time to reinforce this effort.

    • The trick now will be to draw the Inklings into the open, where they can be effectively engaged by any available armor, artillery and helicopter gunships. This becomes particularly attractive if there is an MLRS unit in Boulder. Imagine the KODI, but on a grand scale. Let's hope that Michael shared the sweat lure idea with Boulder, that they've laid in a stock of sweat bottles, and that it works on Inklings! The athletic fields at the University of Colorado campus would make a wonderful killing ground.


    This leads me to a chilling thought. I'm not sure if you mentioned it more explicitly, but do you mean that the soldiers could target and kill humans breaking curfew? This would help slow the growth of the Inkling populations. I read a research abstract, once, about a neural network simulation of a naval battle. The network would sink its own damaged vessels in order to gain better maneuverability of its healthier ships. The fighting here seems like a checkers game where one player's pieces (The Zombies) can behave like either checkers pieces or Othello pieces.

    I can see the use of KODI. If the sweat lure doesn't work they still have noise and, if need be, plenty of corpses laying around doing nothing. If it does work then what about used PTs, gear from the athletic facilities or NikVooDoo and LitMaster dressed in a Datu costume dangling from a wire?


    Quote Originally Posted by LiamKerrington View Post
    CabbagePatch: Thank you, you are awesome. I see the 'weak spots' in my ideas. And granted: The heroes need to deploy the sweat bombs - at least in order to learn how the LOs react to it.
    And you are right: The Little Ones in Boulder act more like Regulars up until now. That struck me already the first time I listened to 34-1, but I failed to realize it properly. Compared to any other activity they had on the complete show it is a different behavior - for whatever reason. Maybe, because they are out of control or have encountered less resistance, since their number is high (several hundred infected within Boulder's walls). Compared with any other time, at which LOs were only few (one to two encountered simultaneously) and were very cautious in engaging armed humans (exception: the one that attacked the car with Briggs, Tardust and Lizzy in it; but that LO was controlled and directly commanded by Bill Roberts/ Pinstripes/ Ink), the LOs in in Boulder are in a frenzy and on a rampage.
    The "cold blooded" strategy makes a lot of sense; never thought of it that way. But naturaly this is the way to deal with any real threat - why risk the lives of many, if you can at least try to put some leverage against the zombies with means of passive resistance ...

    All the best!
    Liam



    Good point. Their cautiousness seems to be the binding trait. This would make developing a lure difficult.

    +CB
    +LK
    Last edited by Witch_Doctor; Oct 4th, 2012 at 09:45 PM. Reason: spelling
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  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Penguine View Post
    Using an MLRS in Boulder would be bad for the city. Can you imagine multiple rockets pounding the city? You'd have civilians getting whacked left and right, building collapsing, it would be havoc.

    As to the civies hiding out with guns... I think I like this idea. Colorado is a huge hunting state with 1000's of gun owners, and more then likely 100000's of rounds at their disposal. I think in a SHTF kind of world the military would be looking for some help draft/militia style.


    You're right. It would also open too many buildings and other hiding places allowing the Inkling access to the tasty treats inside. But I think Cabbage Patch meant to lure them into a centralized open location away from populated areas e.g. the sports stadium.
    Last edited by Witch_Doctor; Oct 4th, 2012 at 02:51 PM. Reason: Spelling
    Call Sign: Jive Turkey
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  6. #126
    Cabbage Patch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witch_Doctor View Post
    This leads me to a chilling thought. I'm not sure if you mentioned it more explicitly, but do you mean that the soldiers could target and kill humans breaking curfew?
    This kind of conflict is serious business, with very little room for compassion. The closest analog from my own experience was the rules-of-engagement during the Cold War in the event of a Soviet invasion of Germany. Civilians were to be given a set period of time to evacuate the border areas. After that we were to assume that there were no civilians in the area and to treat any unexplained movement to be the enemy.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witch_Doctor View Post
    You're right. I would also open too many buildings and other hiding places allowing the Inkling access to the tasty treats inside. But I think Cabbage Patch meant to lure them into a centralized open location away from populated areas e.g. the sports stadium.
    Thanks Witch Doctor, I was, indeed, anticipating using MLRS in the open ground around the University where the sub-munition warheads would have the optimum effect.

    However, if the Army can contain the Inklings in downtown Boulder then I'd still consider using MLRS there, even though it would be less effective and it would cause collateral damage to the infrastructure and to civilians. It's critical to reduce their numbers and force them into a fight in the open, where the soldiers have the advantage. Fighting Inklings inside buildings would be a nightmare! Better to destroy a building with Inklings in it than to risk sending troops in to root them out.

  8. #128
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    So lets connect a few dots here: if its true Griggs zombie maintains memory and so do all the ones he's turned. They turn the correct ones to blow Irwin to pieces. But hey! No sat phone....

    Kimmet just forced one into the air assault team's hand so they'd have a direct line.

    So Michael convinces Kimmet to let him go to boulder. Riley comes along, puck, and Tanya (because she's trained medical staff).... Hopefully Carl too...they all hop on Robbins black hawk and take off. Irwin is then the site that disappears in a brilliant bright light. Boulder doesn't go up with a nuke, but Irwin does.
    ~Ra1th: Nik doesn't sleep, he waits.~
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  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by nikvoodoo View Post
    So Michael convinces Kimmet to let him go to boulder. Riley comes along, puck, and Tanya (because she's trained medical staff).... Hopefully Carl too...they all hop on Robbins black hawk and take off. Irwin is then the site that disappears in a brilliant bright light. Boulder doesn't go up with a nuke, but Irwin does.
    Now that would be a twist!

  10. #130
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    naw you are all wrong KC and the gang are going to a musical and the zombies are going do the dance number from west side story. via sharks and jets


 
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