Chapter 46-2: Under Pressure

[LiamKerrington]

Hmm makes sense. What if all the radon experiments were underground in Inglewood pre ZA. The gas and zombie phenomenon were two after effects.

Does not explain, why zombocalypse seemed to have started in many different areas nearly simultaneously ... This would require Radon Labs and parnters would have had started shit in different locations at the same time. I am not certain, how to express it. And I may be totally wrong - but am I the only one thinking that the gas is not the 'cause of the zombocalypse, but more kind of a reaction to it?

I struggle because I think there is a vital piece of the puzzle missing.

These are the information I base my doubts on:

a) We know that dead zombies are piled up and eaten by alive zombies. And I think we can at least assume (if not be certain) that Angel, Riley, Michael, Victor, Datu, Samantha, and Saul have encountered piled up zombies at the arena. We also know that at least Victor is negatively affected by the gases. So if the dead and piled up zombies release those gases, then there would be kind of a plot-hole for Victor not showing any symptoms anymore.
Granted: Maybe the gases are released only after a certain while and only if the decompsoing and dissolving zombie-bodies remain untouched for quite a long time while they are kept in a somewhat tight and locked up place. Still: I have doubts, because ...

b) Ground zero was without zombies (except for this single encounter with the Little One), when the gases appeared. And we kind of can be certain that the gases were released through the cracks in the ground. So what, if there were no bodies scattered aroung at/ near ground zero, because the gases dissolved them over the time? Or did I miss descriptions telling us that at ground zeros the streets and places were littered with dead zombie-bodies?
So: Now we have these gases at the Mortuary. Are they there because of the dead bodies, or maybe because the basement has some kind of entry-points for the gases to get into the building?

c) Just a thought: Tanyas zombie-indicators remained low and almost vanished, because she stayed for a prolonged period of time in the Mortuary. Because she is not negatively affected by the gases, the gases might have had an imunizing effect on her and made the z-agent vanish from her body. The same gas might be the reason why the dead zombie-bodies have started to dissolve ...

Please tell me, if I miss an important piece of information here. I look forward to being falsified here ...

Best wishes!
Liam

[TacticalJHP]

My question is why didn't they give Tanya some of Skittles' sweat to run tests on. I get that she's a little off right now because of recent events but she thrives when she has something to do. Plus I think if his sweat is a link to the zombies in any way, she'd WANT to test it since she has/had the keratin levels in her blood.

I'm not upset at all about the questioning of Tardust. Riley and Burt don't even know what he almost did/wanted to do to Lizzy. If Riley KNEW what he did to her in addition to what happened to Angel...dude would be z-chow quick fast and in a hurry. That epi with Tardust and Lizzy is the only one I can't listen to on repeat. I have to skip it. That jackass deserves whatever Burt and Riley do.

I am also wondering why Tanya didn't get a blood sample from Duncan. She might have wanted to know if he may have been a slow turner and THAT could have been the reason his sweat smells different.

[Ginja]

I am also wondering why Tanya didn't get a blood sample from Duncan. She might have wanted to know if he may have been a slow turner and THAT could have been the reason his sweat smells different.

Ohhhh I didn't even THINK about his blood!! But I think you're onto something!

[MrRedBeard]

Its been a very musical thread.

.....On the marks: someone figured out already that they probably meant protection and that's why Ink tattoed himself with them. I now think he did it in multiple languages to be sure everyone would get it regardless of their background?
.....Now, the body dissolving in a cloud is interesting. Essentially I'm thinking this happened before.
Theory 1: The corpses were stuffed underground and rot until whatever makes the gas (bacteria, whatever) did its job. Then it stayed there for a long time, possibly some of the corpses turned into oil. A small quake lets the gas escape (the cracks) and boom zombie apocalypse.
Theory 2: the problem with theory 1 is that Ink cannot predict quakes; so I thought of an alternative: it could also be that some of the yellow gas was present in oil, again, oil produced by the corpses buried underground during the last mass extinction event, and that is introduced in the atmosphere through the combustion engine, although in diluted form. Ink could have figured that after so many years of using the combustion engine the concentration of the gas was about to reach critical mass at least in some of the more developed countries and thus he could have prepared accordingly.
I personally love theory 2, mostly because it makes Eugenio Barsanti responsible for the whole apocalypse and thus this old message becomes relevant to the scenario.

This became part of the discussion on FanCast this week. I like theory #1 for sure and #2 fits an eco scenario but seems out there but regardless I like it.

Now the question: If Ink uses these symbols, does he use them in order to make zombos leave the gas-areas?

Best wishes!
Liam

My question is if they put the 5 lines to a point with a rainbow symbol on Dunbar would the zombies leave it alone or invite them in.

I said before I wasn't a huge fan of torturing Tardust. That being said... there is torture and there is Torture. One can say that cutting back rations to a prisoner is torture. Locking them in solitary is torture. Both of those are not huge OMG!!! things. Nothing like being beaten with hammers and cutting off fingers.

While I am not a fan of even this much, running Tardust behind the car isn't really hardcore. It is more mental. Seems that they stop anytime they see him fall. They are not dragging him behind the car for long periods of time. It is a dark path though. While, IMO, not a big deal at the moment could turn into something really bad if the show went on for a few more seasons. If their version of torture is just lots of running, then I am not worried to much. It is petty mild to be honest. No long term damage. Just a nap and you are better.

.....I like the way the symbols are turning out. They hit on that he had to know something. I think it was Elisa that has that theroy. The one where he tat'd himself up with a bunch of stuff hoping one would stick. If so.... High Five! You're awesome. I will have to so back and look at the thread and give ya rep for it.

This was also a point of discussion on the FanCast. Right there with you on the torture. Riley is starting to parallel Scratch in some ways and makes me agree with Osiris's thoughts from the last thread a bit more about who was the antagonist.

Also I hope the biodiesel conversation was a shout out to Redbeard of We're Alive Fancast. Unless KC says otherwise.. it will be in my head.

Ha! Yea KC didn't really see Bio-Diesel as a viable option.

One thing that came to mind: If a zombie jumped out at attacked Tardust while being dragged, how would Riley and Burt be able to stop it, if they were driving? unless someone was ready....

Kinda like fishing... I see a new sport!

Now onto more serious matters:

Haze in the Mortuary.
So Tanya seems to be through the woods when it comes to infection (although I know I can't be the only one who thought she was about to turn when she had to go back into the mortuary to get her notes. Always a bad sign when information is about to be delivered but has to be stalled.) But she is still showing signs of immunity. I really don't know what to make of all this other than what we've already learned.
The other interesting thing is that the haze seems to comes from the decomposing zombie corpses (or maybe the gas gets trapped in the zombies and then slowly leeches back out after they die?) I wonder, maybe the zombies aren't a new phenomenon. What if there have been outbreaks in the distant past, followed by lots of zombie corpses getting trapped underground, releasing gas as they decompose, then the gas gets suddenly released thousands of years later and we get a new outbreak. OK maybe that deserves a

Alright and now for the final topic brought up in the episode:
The ethical treatment of prisoners (or lack thereof) by Riley and Burt.
I've always been a big fan of Riley, but I've said before that I don't like the path she's going down, and I still don't. Sure, their treatment of Tardust wasn't as bad as it could have been (as far as we know he still has all his appendages), but threatening to road haul the guy isn't something I can condone. Especially since I still don't think he was trying to hide anything and as someone else said I think the cabin was a last ditch hail mary on his part to save himself. And I wonder, if he hadn't thought of the cabin, what would Riley and Burt have done? I like to hope that the "just keep going and drag him" stuff was a bluff since not only would it have been well beyond the Moral Event Horizon, but also because it wouldn't have served their purpose of getting information. But the tone in Riley's voice makes me wonder if she isn't close to going completely off the deep end.
I don't think any of this bodes well for Riley and Burt's future in the series. Going down this kind of dark path is a good way to coax karma into taking a big bite out of your ass, and I have a feeling that whatever they find in the cabin isn't going to end well for at least one of them.

Right up there with Clem but more refined. I like this theory a lot. Also a point of discussion.

Torture
The problem with it is you get the answer you want. Ask a question, get an answer. If one does not like the answer insert torture here. Rinse, lather, repeat. Burt and Riley are sure Tardust knows. He could have easily have no clue and just told them where to find Durai's dad who is way more paranoid and a hermet with beaucoup de booby traps and shoots on sight.

Corpse Gas.
Damn, It just begs the question, is there something special about the people immune or disturbed by the gas? The most likely is that there is something special about Saul and Tanya. It may correlate with Keratin level perturbation. But, this is a small sample size and I am not ready to collapse this wave function.

Biodiesel
Damn, Burt. Forget about it. You would just be chasing another logistic supply chain. He is going to need Ethanol/Methanol and a strong alkali like sodium or potassium hydroxide. They would be much better off to hit the naval yards and find some prepositioned resupply nodes.

Points of discussion on the fancast. I completely agree with you on the subject of torture. What if he didn't know anything else and just felt pressure to give any answer? As far as Biodiesel - Wood Gas & Lye Soap

Yeah, there is definitely a pattern why Michael conducts suicidal recon missions almost on a weekly basis.

Haha

For the first time I started screaming, "Oh my god! Oh my god!" while listening to W.A. Cool feeling.
The reason was because of the gas in the mortuary. It sounds like the gas is escaping from the decomposing bodies. (Not the other way around, where the gas decomposes the bodies.) The pressure of the gas building up within the bodies causes it to escape as a haze. I wondered if this could be a very ancient agent that seeped underground, escaping through volcanic and tectonic faults, after enough pressure had built up around the globe.

Or, imagine a new ground zero brewing from the 6 million missing decomposing bodies buried under L.A.

Yes yes these theories gets me excited. More stories for the future or the past for KC to tell.

And here's a scientific cross-section of the little-studied Zed Layer:
Attachment 3145

download.jpg

The worst part of this whole episode was the banter between Saul and Victor...... Too much laughing, Too much reminiscing.......... Someone is going to die shortly and that is sad.......

Ouch you're probably right. I chalked it up to denial and distraction.

Does not explain, why zombocalypse seemed to have started in many different areas nearly simultaneously ... This would require Radon Labs and parnters would have had started shit in different locations at the same time. I am not certain, how to express it. And I may be totally wrong - but am I the only one thinking that the gas is not the 'cause of the zombocalypse, but more kind of a reaction to it?

I struggle because I think there is a vital piece of the puzzle missing.

These are the information I base my doubts on:

a) We know that dead zombies are piled up and eaten by alive zombies. And I think we can at least assume (if not be certain) that Angel, Riley, Michael, Victor, Datu, Samantha, and Saul have encountered piled up zombies at the arena. We also know that at least Victor is negatively affected by the gases. So if the dead and piled up zombies release those gases, then there would be kind of a plot-hole for Victor not showing any symptoms anymore.
Granted: Maybe the gases are released only after a certain while and only if the decompsoing and dissolving zombie-bodies remain untouched for quite a long time while they are kept in a somewhat tight and locked up place. Still: I have doubts, because ...

b) Ground zero was without zombies (except for this single encounter with the Little One), when the gases appeared. And we kind of can be certain that the gases were released through the cracks in the ground. So what, if there were no bodies scattered aroung at/ near ground zero, because the gases dissolved them over the time? Or did I miss descriptions telling us that at ground zeros the streets and places were littered with dead zombie-bodies?
So: Now we have these gases at the Mortuary. Are they there because of the dead bodies, or maybe because the basement has some kind of entry-points for the gases to get into the building?

c) Just a thought: Tanyas zombie-indicators remained low and almost vanished, because she stayed for a prolonged period of time in the Mortuary. Because she is not negatively affected by the gases, the gases might have had an imunizing effect on her and made the z-agent vanish from her body. The same gas might be the reason why the dead zombie-bodies have started to dissolve ...

Please tell me, if I miss an important piece of information here. I look forward to being falsified here ...

Best wishes!
Liam

More reason to have a live show next week. If you guys are up for it I say lets make it happen.

[LiamKerrington]

More reason to have a live show next week. If you guys are up for it I say lets make it happen.

Life show next week? Tell me more!

[Grognaurd]

Liam,

I think Saul's and Victor's first trip to ground zero described uncollected dead. People seemed to have died there, but were not collected like the other five million people in LA

I find it interesting that whatever the gas haze was melted through the body bag. If it was a real body bag, they are designed to contain body rot. Even if it is not, plastic does a good job resisting biology. Was it a strong exothermic reaction (heat) that melted it?

I think we must keep an open mind. It could very well be a chemical gas, but I would not rule out a spore cloud. We could have a fungus that throws spores, infects people, manipulates the host and then converts the host into more spores. I do not like to go too in depth with this stuff. It used to be my day job... But, I will allow myself another piled higher and deeper... Lol

There is a class of microbes that produce methane. It could be possible to harness this process and combine it with the spore life cycle. For dispersal, low density is better. Dandolines put those big pompom hats on to help the wind disperse them. Spores are pretty dense, but what if the microscopic spore had a methane balloon two or three times the size of the spore? It would still be microscopic, and much easier to disperse. We can milk this a bit more and have the spores sit in the methane deep underground and is disturbed by the hydrolic fracking technology that is now being used to vastly increase the amount of natural gas we can pump out of the ground. In real life they are fracking at ground zero.

I can go further down the crazy train, the slime molds normally do there own thing, but when a few of them think the growing conditions suck, they start pumping out a chemical signal to other slime molds to team up and produce spores together. I do not think KC has gone this route, but we have hard science that a single celll microbe can send out a signal that causes them to organize into a multicellular organism. Scifi can take the same concept and push it world wide to have multiple outbreaks.

[katlero]

The worst part of this whole episode was the banter between Saul and Victor...... Too much laughing, Too much reminiscing..........


Someone is going to die shortly and that is sad.......

It's gonna be Saul.... stop denying it!

[Grognaurd]

Redbeard, woodgas is a different process than biodisel. It uses a controlled fire to produce a smoke that can be used in the engine as an explosive gas. I would much rather see them try a woodgas conversion. Not as versatile or power dense as biodiesel, but easier logistics

[Gnex]

It's gonna be Saul.... stop denying it!

hush that talk!!!! Saul will never give up, he will never surrender!!!!

[katlero]

hush that talk!!!! Saul will never give up, he will never surrender!!!!

Never gonna let us down.... never gonna run around or desert us?

I do think he will make me cry when we have to say goodbye.