They're Coming...For Your Guns!!!

[Ordinary12]

There's been a major increase in the amount of crazy people walking our streets lately and the solution of our government seems to be the disarming of the people who are being victimized by the crazy people. Does anyone else find this line of thought flawed? If you're reading this post then you're probably a fan of the "We're Alive" story. Just imagine trying to survive in a zombie outbreak while at the same time your government says you will be arrested if you have a gun for self defense. INSANE!!! Every person in the world is not a MMA Master...the majority of us are couch surfers. We need guns to protect ourselves from the crazy people out there.

I'm also very angry about the labels being assigned to people for exercising common sense. There was an ice storm in 1996 that left the majority of the south without power for two weeks or more. If you weren't prepared for an emergency at that time then you were in a world of hurt. The same thing can be applied to the people on the east coast right now. So why does the media label people right wing extremeist for having more than one weeks worth of food in storage? Why are people labeled as potential terrorist for owning a gun and having enough ammo to repel an outside threat? What has happened to this country? There was a time when highschool aged boys would have gun racks in there trucks when they drove to school!!! Having a pantry that was well stocked was completely expected.

So...now comes the question. Do you know what the Second Amendment was written for? Its not for hunting...its for defending yourself from a tyranical government and from the crazies of this world. The first thing a tyranical government does when it comes into power is disarm the people so they can't fight back when they go "Crazy Train" on the people. If you don't have a gun and at least one thousand rounds for it then make it a priority. There's no such thing as Superman...anyone can be killed... and your familly is not immune from the rest of the world. Protect what's important to you.

[turbo]

It's a little scary with all the gun control talk. I know some states are pretty serious about making sure their people can have their guns. I mean hell, Oklahoma is starting this week an open carry law...http://www.opencarry.org/?page_id=288

I believe in the second amendment and own guns. Illinois is not a concealed carry(yet), but mine are locked up, only i know where the keys are and they are safe. These kind of events are driven by deeper problems, not necessarily just mental health, but several things come into play.

Just because someone has access to a gun, like you said, are labeled and hated upon.

[Litmaster]

Just because someone has access to a gun, like you said, are labeled and hated upon.

More people die from drunk drivers every year than from crazies in school shootings, but you don't hear anyone calling to take away cars or booze.

[DaTank]

Guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people, but if they are zombies or self defense then it's ok

[scbubba]

More people die from drunk drivers every year than from crazies in school shootings, but you don't hear anyone calling to take away cars or booze.

Yeah, it's funny how folks will use (and ignore) numbers to make their point. Many of the numbers I see talking about the number of deaths caused by guns in the US include suicides. They also include defensive gun uses that resulted in the attacker/perp death.

A lot of people, those with and without agendas against gun ownership, are looking for simple answers in the wake of the Newtown, CT tragedy. There are no simple answers to something like this. More laws making it harder to have legal gun ownership has not been effective here yet.

[nikvoodoo]

Guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people, but if they are zombies or self defense then it's ok

I think the gun helps.

More people die from drunk drivers every year than from crazies in school shootings, but you don't hear anyone calling to take away cars or booze.

We make it harder to drive than own a gun. You have to take classes, get permits, pass a practical and written test, eye exam..... Or I could go to a gun show and buy an assault rifle.

Yeah, it's funny how folks will use (and ignore) numbers to make their point. Many of the numbers I see talking about the number of deaths caused by guns in the US include suicides. They also include defensive gun uses that resulted in the attacker/perp death.

82% of the stats listed online are made up.

No one with a head on their shoulders is suggesting abolition of all guns. But. Can anyone tell me legit reason one needs military grade assault weapons, extended clips, or fully automatic anything?

[reaper239]

this is a topic that has gone around ad nauseum (i think i spelled that right (i like to use big words, but i never know how to spell them)) our solanine, our resident brit, espouses highly the virtues of gun control, while folk like me argue that since criminals don't follow the law, restrictions shouldn't be placed upon law abiding citizens who would be under no inclination to break the law in the first place. if you search deep enough, you will find several threads with some very thought out discussion (and some downright internet screaming matches (although those were more between osi and myself (before we became bros))) regarding the issue of gun control. since we're alive is such a great show, it draws a crowd ranging the full spectrum of ideological, political, and religious beliefs.

be advised, it gets dark towards the end.

note: i was rereading over this and i wanted to put a caveat: i got very emotional towards the end of this. if it comes across a little strong, that's the emotion. i'm not going to edit it, because i feel that it's what i intended to say, i just wanted to make a note here.

now, regarding the topic at hand (cracks knuckles over keyboard) let's consider the israeli (or utah for that matter) model: in israel, the soloution to school house massacre is to arm the teachers, and it works. in utah, i believe, every school district has classroom concealed carry, and there have been precisely 0 school massacres in utah. places where freedom is allowed to flourish are places where you have less crime. i personally believe that the purpose of legislation should be solely to protect the rights of individuals, ie: if i smash your window, i have to pay for it, or if you crash your car into a building, you have to pay to fix it. to that end, gun control serves to needlessly infringe on the rights of the individual, without providing any benefit to counterbalance the infringment. how did that gun free zone work, connecticut? how did that gun free movie theater treat you, aurora? criminals, or psychopaths as it were, pay no heed to the law that says you can't murder people, what on earth makes you think that they would pay any mind whatsoever to a sign on a wall? what logic says that the way to defend against an insane man with a gun is to disarm the sane people in the crowd? connecticut ranked 4th on the brady campaigns report card of gun control, and yet all of those gun laws completely and utterly failed to prevent this man from storming into a school with stolen guns and shooting 20 children and 7 staff. 20 children, 20 of them. think about that for a moment, there are 20 children who will not be home for Christmas with their parents, who will never grow up to fufill their dreams of becoming police (as my own little brother dreams) or doctors, or president of the united states. the people who created the environment where this is possible should be held criminally liable imo. i'm done, i went a lot darker than i meant to, but damnit, this crap about brought me to tears.

[reaper239]

I think the gun helps.



We make it harder to drive than own a gun. You have to take classes, get permits, pass a practical and written test, eye exam..... Or I could go to a gun show and buy an assault rifle.



82% of the stats listed online are made up.

No one with a head on their shoulders is suggesting abolition of all guns. But. Can anyone tell me legit reason one needs military grade assault weapons, extended clips, or fully automatic anything?

because criminals have those things, and i want to be at least as well armed as them, and the government while i'm at it. besides, the second ammendment isn't about need. you have a right lo life, what need does anyone have to live to 90? does it really matter. law abiding citizens won't break the law, whether they have "military grade" equipment or not. btw, it's very difficult, and expensive, to get anything fully auto.

[scbubba]

We make it harder to drive than own a gun. You have to take classes, get permits, pass a practical and written test, eye exam..... Or I could go to a gun show and buy an assault rifle.

I think we definitely have an issue with not treating long guns and handguns the same way with respect to background checks and waiting periods.

82% of the stats listed online are made up.

And a bunch of them aren't. I've looked at stats used by both sides of the issue (specifically the Handgun Control Institue and the NRA) and they both "massage" the numbers to fit their agendas. HCI (and other folks on their side) have, in some cases, included suicides and defensive gun uses in their numbers for gun deaths. While those deaths did result from guns, they mislead people. The NRA has inflated their numbers for defensive gun uses by extrapolating from numbers of guns privately owned and not from hard reported numbers (because apparently a lot of defensive gun uses that don't result in death or injury are not reported).

My point is that numbers like that don't tell the story. It's a deeper issue than a post on facebook or a 30 sec sound byte on CNN can portray.

No one with a head on their shoulders is suggesting abolition of all guns. But. Can anyone tell me legit reason one needs military grade assault weapons, extended clips, or fully automatic anything?

I'll agree with you about the people calling for abolition of guns: they probably don't have a good head on their shoulders. But there are a lot of people calling for an abolition of provate gun ownership. Of all kinds of guns. Thankfully they are a minority.

As far as legit reasons for some of the things you mentioned: I'll go to my understanding of the 2nd Amendment - it's there to protect us against threats foreign and domestic. This nation was formed in a revolution against the governing power. We put protections into the new nation against another governing power like that.

Should it be as easy as a craigslist meet-up to buy a .50cal bolt action rifle or AR-15? Probably not. And you can't legally do that in a lot of places. Some places you can (Colorado and Arizona for example, if I recall correctly). And it's pretty damned hard to legally acquire full auto weapons (but it is possible to legally do it in a lot of states).

I'm not against laws around firearms. We have a lot. But let's face it, no matter how many we have, disturbed and/or violent people will find a way....

[nikvoodoo]

My 82% comment was made in jest. I did not mean to disparage what you were saying about gun deaths, though the sites I've been visiting do break it down to the different degrees...I suppose for lack of a better term right now...

The second amendment is intended to create a militia against the British should they decide to come back. This was before the US had a military industrial complex and a standing army, navy, marine corp and air force.....especially the air force....if they had figured that out back then I'd be really impressed...

The idea that the citizenship of the US can even be as well armed as the government has become preposterous. If that's the case, we should have access to nuclear weapons and drones. That's why I'd say remove military grade weapons from the populace. And the same thing would apply that everyone has been talking about in terms of people finding a way...if the need arises, I'm sure those who would overthrow a tyrannical US government could get those weapons.