Yeah... you'd swear it was THE episode to end all episodes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adventureless_Hero
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Yeah... you'd swear it was THE episode to end all episodes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adventureless_Hero
Now that they are all back together it will be interesting how they will take the fight to them instead of the survivors being always attack. I wonder what Scratch and the other mallers are up to? Will there be a truce?
That would be epic.Quote:
Originally Posted by reaper239
Hey I know this is probably the wrong episode but why was that helicopter recon mission sent out to LA by the military? The one that ended up picking up all the Inklets and destroying Boulder Safe Zone? Sorry fuzzy memory. :p
And I do agree, love the season finales in one big episode/podcast. :yay:
Oh shit no, sir... peace with Scratch will only be brought about by handing Pegs over with a ribbon in her hair.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaTank
Truce does not imply peace, does it?
Wouldn't it be nice to see another evil scheme of deceit and lies from Scratch? Like: She accepts the truce with Michael and guys, joins forces; and in the right moment she kills Pegs. Too far-fetched, or pretty much Scratch-style? One flaw in this picture: Scratch might be way to proud to agree in a truce with anyone for as long as she has options.
My view of Scratch is that she could be sneaky enough to agree to the "truce" long enough to get what she wants. I'm not sure that anyone on the other side would do it. So far, just about everyone from the Tower group (aka, our heroes) has stated a hatred for, and desire to kill (in various ways) our little Scratch.Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamKerrington
In other words, I would be amazed if Michael and Co. were to actually trust her long enough for a truce to be made. But then again, it is quite an extraordinary set of events that has brought us to season 4 now....
I agree with you that there will be no truce with Scratch and that there are some choices that every character has on order to surviveQuote:
Originally Posted by Osiris
It's the very definition of the word, sir.Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamKerrington
Quote:
Originally Posted by DaTank
Haha. Oh you were serious? (Only teasing)
I doubt that scratch is gonna switch over to the light side...ever.
And in the freaky chance that she did, it wouldn't matter the gang has a pretty big grudge with her.
- 1 Finger roughly chopped
- 1 dead leuitenant
- 1 damaged tower
-Return later to burn it down and kill all b-roles
- 1 captured and killed girl
- mix all together and add a dash of fury fueled vendetta against the dirty hippie.
She wouldn't switch to the light side. But if she saw a huge benefit (like finally getting a realistic chance to kill off Pegs, and along that Scratch's own survival), then Scratch would join forces - how unlikely this may seem at the moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by awkwardalex
I wouldn't want Scratch for an enemy for as long as she had the slightest chance to kick my ass; but I'd like to see her on my ranks for soldiers or minions to fight for my cause, even with her evil demeanor - or because of it - combined with her fighting abilities.
No I wasn't serious, I knew that there would never be a truce, but I am curious about angel and scratch thoughQuote:
Originally Posted by awkwardalex
I do not think that there will be a truce between Scratch and Team Good in season 4. She has crossed the rubicon a long time ago. Of course there could always be ways to force a temporary truce but hands down - in my opinion this would not be a good example of genuine storytelling as most of us can recount numerous similar situations from TV or movie history.Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamKerrington
Furthermore, if Scratch joins Team Good, I expect the next step of Team Good to be juggling with unlocked thermal detonators. :D
Just my 2 ct.
So, Scratch is an offspring of Mr Wulff then? (That'S an insider for us Germans ...)
As I said: I don't exclude the possibility that all may join forces (the enemy of my enemy blablabla ...); but I agree to the simple fact that the threshold for remaining Mallers and remaining Twoerites/Colonists is put very, very high.
Besides: Wouldn't it be nice to see a deviance from standard-issue storytelling? :yay:
All the best!
Liam
I was not thinking of Mr Wulff Liam, I recently watched a documentary about the Roman Empire, that is all. Besides, Mr Wulff misused this very reference in one of the most awkward kind of ways...Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamKerrington
However, I do not want to deny that there might be a very, very, very tiny possibility. I mean, even Hitler joined the US army.
But hell, NOOOOO way! :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WWaLxFIVX1s
That's not Darth Vader. That's the joke ending Episode III of a trilogie that is an aberration ... ;)
But I got your point.
Episode III? I think you are wrong, there was never an Eps 3 of Star Wars. Only ones I know about are 4,5,6 and that it.Quote:
Originally Posted by LiamKerrington
You were right, if I had spoken of Star Wars Episode III; but I spoke only of Episode III, which is something completely different.Quote:
Originally Posted by UndeadSweeper
I heard they might remaster those "other" films to remove any and all references of Jar Jar out of them. I think the re-release will be one movie entitled: "Star Wars: Episodes I - III: Sorry about that"Quote:
Originally Posted by UndeadSweeper
Not gonna lie, I wept a bit when the chopper showed up at the end of the episode.
It was one of those moments of hope ...Quote:
Originally Posted by antros
Definitely one of those dramatic moments I love to come across in a series. I let out a "whoop!" when I listened the first time.... :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by antros
Seconded. The whole scene reminded me of the good old Airwolf days...Quote:
Originally Posted by scbubba
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rO_LR4X-43Y
[QUOTE=reaper239;53472]did anyone else cheer when vic stabbed the little one in the eye?
I would have but I'd just been bitch-slapped by a not-so-little one!
i deliberatly did not listen to the episode when it first came out i decided to wait and savour the moment. i waited till just after xmas to listen to it. so late one night after taking tasha (my rottie) for her final walk of the night, it was midnight and 32 below.....thats c not f lol im from canada. for some reason i cant remember i went to the basement and opened the cabinet where i keep my old army uniform and webgear from my time in the service. I pulled my old canteen cup and made a cup of coffee with a splash of rum in it. tasha and i sat in the kitchen with the lights off and just the flickering of a small candle i set out and we listened. rest of family was asleep so there was no distractions. i found myself sitting forward and feeling the physical tension in my body as i lived with the characters i have come to know. the frustration, relief and excitement i experienced was quite profound. i look forward to the next season and have placed the old metal cup in the kitchen cabinet with the candle in anticipation.
Tanya will have to amputate CJ's leg, replacing it with a long silver stiletto (for bad-ass effect) with a roller skate on the bottom = NAILED IT! Uh, well... this hasn't happened YET, but GET THAT STILETTO READY, KC!
I stop by often just to read others perspective of the show but never felt a need to respond. I enjoy your insightful predictions most of all.
I nearly feel off the couch when I read this post. It warrants a reply now that I can type again.
Nice one Litmaster. :D:D
Listened to this episode at least 5 times. I'll probably be playing it at least five more.
Been listening to the episode at least 8 times, going way back to listen all of them to keep me busy
I wonder if the second nuke was in one of the barracks. Here are some hints:
- Chapter 28, part 2, Pucks warns the new arrivals to Fort Irwin to stay off of the second and third floors. (Of course it is before Kimmet returns from Pantec.
- Kimmet seem to be herding the survivors to and around the barracks and using them to lure the Inklings into the area of the barracks.
- The Black Hawk is last heard while hovering over the barracks. (This is likely due to the fact that the story is being told in audio form, i.e. the best way to hint at the bomb's location without visually showing it)
Anyway, doesn't matter, it seems.
Would they even let civilians on the C-130 if it had the nukes on it? IF they wanted to keep the nukes secret, then flying it with non-military who shouldn't know they exist would be a bad idea.
Or he sent them via separate transport and the one in Boulder got there before our heroes. Either way, it makes you wonder about I decisions like that. What does it do to people to have to make decisions about who lives and who dies on a pretty massive scale? Reminds me of the Cuban Missle Crisis and the Cold War.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch
Alright, I don't have much, just a few things I want to throw out there... only the end of Season Three and a Thirty-Six page thread to catch up on, but I'm BACK.
I regretfully doubt it. The B-53 was a 9 Megaton device:Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch
(Please see below for my chagrined corrections.)
Attachment 2376Attachment 2377
It would have more or less glassed the garrison proper and done significant damage to the entire "bowl" valley Irwin sat in. I don't think that there would have been enough time for that chopper to make it far enough to make it to significant terrain to shadow behind. The B-53 was actually a bit of over kill.
CP Nailed it, it is over 1300 Miles with the ESSS tank modification, but it was a Chinook that they took to LA.Quote:
Originally Posted by scbubba
Well, there is the Airport, the fuel depot and don't forget, LA is an Oil Town.Quote:
Originally Posted by scbubba
(For frack's sake. I thought I posted info about that here on the forums, a Youtube video on it. It's Killing me, not being able to find it. Anyway, check THIS for reference.)
It isn't. LA to Amarillo is 937.5 miles. (Round trip 1875) The only thing they MIGHT have at their disposal is an ESSS equipped Blackhawk, and that's a one-way trip.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witch_Doctor
For your consideration, here's a list of aircraft and fuel ranges I was researching for transportation to PANTEX. It is still relevant as, in addition to the Pelican, it lists other aircraft they might be able to get their hands on. If they're lucky.
I Did. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Slim FiTT
No, no, no. It's R2DATU & The Millennium Pelican. Thanks again for that Witch_Doctor.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikvoodoo
There's no way it could have fit in Hummer, the damn things were the size of a Hummer. They only weigh just a bit over 4 tons and would fit on a C130 so it is in the realm of possibility that it could have been on their plane.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cabbage Patch
Maybe, maybe not. The B-53 doesn't look like what a "popularized" bomb looks like, throw a tarp over it and call it a water tank. The civvies would be none the wiser.Quote:
Originally Posted by StrangeMeadowlark
Alright, two predictions:
- We learn that CJ is COL Kimmet's other niece, the Black Sheep of the Kimmet family.
- Radiation poisoning becomes evident in one or more of the characters that evac'd out of Boulder.
Oh yeah. The B-53. I kinda called it.No I didn't, cuz Imma dummy :o
Boom goes the dynamite.
Hey hey hey, Red Shirt is back :D Good to see you, buddy. As always, really good, thoughtful post.
One correction though, the nukes were 1.2 mT B83s, not propane tank-sized B53.
B-83 Attachment 2379
B-53 Attachment 2378
B-52 Attachment 2380
Crap. Just checked the wiki on it and found the thread that I should have known about. Notably Cabbage Patch's blast & fallout report.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witch_Doctor
And that kids, is what happens when you don't have internet.
:DQuote:
OK, so thank you goes to Witch_Doctor for pointing out my error with the type of warhead that was used, and to Cabbage Patch for their work on the previously mentioned blast and fallout report.
With that information in hand, I reviewed my damage assessment of Irwin. Which is still a total loss:
Attachment 2381Attachment 2382
You can see that the damage is still extensive and that the garrison proper is still toast.
However,
Several important considerations to think about are that:
- The B-83 overall size is mostly a delivery device. Hell, the rear third is a parachute. The actual physics package is only 3-4 feet long and easily hidden...
- Hidden where? if Kimmet had it placed in a basement then blast mitigation is slightly on our side. If he placed it, say at the top of a water tower then the damage could have been greater. (The blast calculator tool doesn't specify sub-surface, surface or air burst...)
- The B-83 has a variable yield warhead, adjustable from the low Kt range to a max of 1.2 Mt...
I still think though, that any birds in the air were probably destroyed. But, if they reacted fast enough, it is possible that they might have been able to shadow behind terrain to escape the blast. Any of the mountains to the West, North or South may have been sufficient. However, there was still a massive EMP associated with this detonation...
The Ammo Holding Area South of garrison would likely be a total loss, as would the West AHA. Both AHA's are relatively close, the South AHA across a stretch of open flat land. However, depending on the exact location of the bomb in garrison and that the doors of the south ammo bunkers face away from base and the West AHA is 'behind' a small mountain, it is possible that they survived the blast.
(I am looking at the satellite for the AHA locations, I have no idea if they were in use in May of 2009.)
Again, depending on the location of the bomb, it is possible that C130's parked out at Bicycle Lake Army Airfield might have survived the blast. It is hard to say if the mountains between garrison and the likely parking area at BLAA are tall enough. I don't recall if it was directly addressed, but I think that with Boulder getting overrun, airworthy C130's would have taken off for Irwin... with or without evacuees.
I think it might be time to go back to Bell and hit up Supply's NBC cage and get some Radiacs.
Curious, Kimmet thought he could hold the fort with the troops he had, but in the end he nuke it cause there was no other choice except go to the colony with Michael and the others.
From Kimmet's introduction, he seemed like a strait shooter, a ball buster to be sure, but generally on the up an up. You don't make it to full bird by being everyone's friend.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaTank
Yes, he did put into place the nuclear contingency. That, while terrifying, also seemed to me to be a tactically sound decision. I mentioned previously that under the provisions of the Continuity of Operations Plan and during the PANTEX discussion that:
All of his actions to that point seemed to be in following with what he was allowed to do and frankly with what he should have done.Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Shirt
With learning that his Niece had been killed however, presumably the last family he had, he seemed to slowly become "unhinged." Despite Micheal's experience with the zed's in LA, he ignored his advice. Advice that might have stopped or at least curtailed the events In Boulder and subsequently Ft. Irwin.
With the loss of Boulder and the overwhelming attack on Irwin, Kimmet lost it. Reasoning with him at this point would have been like nailing jello to the wall.
Sane, well balanced officers don't pull their sidearm on their subordinates. They also can recognize that they are not just losing a battle, but also losing their foothold in an established safe zone. They don't heard civvies into a holding area to lure zeds into a Nuclear Kill Zone. Simply put, Kimmet went insane, clinically & certifiable. At that point, nothing he did would make sense.
........ ck!