Chapter 25- Inadequate Strength part 3

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Originally Posted by HaveCrowBarWillTravel

Fletch,
I'm a bit confused. Man,.. this gonna be hard to say without sounding like a dick (sorry). You started off with how easily the base..er, post could be overrun and ended with how much bad ass stuff is there. Again, sorry for sounding like an ass.
I'm not sure how the Army secures their munitions but in the AF all of ours is behind super secure fences guarded by troops with M16's/M4s. M203 and M60/M240 (showing you my age) We typically carried 120 rounds each for a 20 man flight. the Rapid response force or 15/5 (meaning and additional 15 personnel had to respond to the WSA within 5 minutes)The Muns guys have access to the munitions and know which ones are which and the doors to the bunkers open pretty easy when you have the access to get in.
Now, with all that live fire ammo for the tanks and whatnot, it'd be pretty hard to overrun a base..er post so far out and them not be ready for it.
Another thing, you don't even need ammo for a tank. If you have 4 brigades worth of armored vehicles.. they don't need ammo. just drive over them and wash the treds later.

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No offense taken and you don't sound like a D***, it's a very intelligent question.... Well... Just because there is a ton of BA stuff there doesn't mean that it isn't easily overrun. I'm just saying that most people have the impression that an army post has a ton of soldiers walking around with tons of ammo. When I was in the army, and was unlucky enough to be put on ammo detail at Ft Irwin, there was no reactionary force and there were only 2 soldiers there with side arms. The rest of the folks who worked at the ammo facility were civilians with out guns. It was pretty much the same on Ft Stewert when I was stationed there. I did get out of the army just before 9-11 so things may have changed, but getting to the ammo is not a simple task. If there are only a couple guys holding weapons, and they would definately be reluctant to shoot especially being stateside. It's unlikely that they would be warned prior to seeing the first zombie.

I definately agree that one could get to the motorpool quickly, jump in an M1 and start crushing zombies.... But how many of the soldiers stationed there can drive a tank, or a Bradly, or an M113 ? The majority of the troops there are support troops who wouldn't know where to even look for the "start" button on an M1 or a Bradley. but the rate of infection and and confusion that must have been happening would be overwheming and would take soldiers by surprise as it did everyone else.

Ultimately, soldiers are people too and would react much in the same way as civilians... they would be disoriented and confused and it would be pretty easy for a bunch of zombies with ever growing number to take over anything. You mentioned that Irwin is really far out. True, but knowing about the zombie outbreak ahead of time I suppose would be the key to wheter or not it would be easy to defend. If they had no warning ahead of time then I would argue that it would be easily overrun.

Running over shi* in an M1 is fun and if it were zombies, that would be even more fun.

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Originally Posted by Arthur LaMarche

But, if we find out that it was an alien invasion were the abductees of the past are taken to the mothership and the rest of humanity subjected to the virus at the same time, to complicate things, the alien invasion happens on the same day as the Rapture so a whole bunch of other people are pulled out on the same day we get whacked with a solar flare that knocks out the satelights, I will be pretty pissed.

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As will I. I can handle a secret terrorist cell orchestrating a simultaneous bio-attack on worldwide chem-labs that goes horribly wrong, but if KC pulls out anything like alien invasions, time travel, or something out of Revelations... I will be officially pissed!

I don't care if it's cliche. A zombie-inducing genetic disease out of control is fine with me. Bring on the rabies on 'roids.


But--for the love of God-- stay away from aliens.

Well I for one think Crowbar sounded like a dick.....

Just joshin'!!

And whomever said on the previous page (pardon my laziness) that Hope is more important than we might think, I brought up that exact point on the upcoming WND #27! Now....if my computer didn't eat the file, maybe you'll get to hear it!

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Originally Posted by nikvoodoo

And whomever said on the previous page (pardon my laziness) that Hope is more important than we might think, I brought up that exact point on the upcoming WND #27! Now....if my computer didn't eat the file, maybe you'll get to hear it!

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I'll be sure to give it a listen. There is gotta be a reason to have Hope there, beyond just being a symbolic embodiment (*gag* *puke*)....

Realistically, the main usefulness of a blind girl in the midst of a zombie apocalypse would be as zombie chow, but I doubt Kc has brought her this far just to have Michael chuck her to the Eaters just to buy himself a few more seconds head start...

The only thing I can think of is that she has some super-unique skill that no one else has, something that will be the KEY to unlocking the Whole Enchilada...

A Zombie-Psychic?
Or maybe her pitch-perfect voice can charm them into a passive state?
Or a master on the kazoo who will lead them, lemming-like, off the nearest cliff??
She's really Scratch's daughter and will be the key to unifying the clans???


Ah hell... I dunno.

Maybe she's a blind red herring and will just fall out of the chopper in the next episode. :zombieglomp:

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Originally Posted by litmaster

I'll be sure to give it a listen. There is gotta be a reason to have Hope there, beyond just being a symbolic embodiment (*gag* *puke*)....

Realistically, the main usefulness of a blind girl in the midst of a zombie apocalypse would be as zombie chow, but I doubt Kc has brought her this far just to have Michael chuck her to the Eaters just to buy himself a few more seconds head start...

The only thing I can think of is that she has some super-unique skill that no one else has, something that will be the KEY to unlocking the Whole Enchilada...

A Zombie-Psychic?
Or maybe her pitch-perfect voice can charm them into a passive state?
Or a master on the kazoo who will lead them, lemming-like, off the nearest cliff??
She's really Scratch's daughter and will be the key to unifying the clans???


Ah hell... I dunno.

Maybe she's a blind red herring and will just fall out of the chopper in the next episode. :zombieglomp:

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I have been thinking the same thing about her being somehow related to the Mallers. Or possibly Kalani being a former Maller or acquaintance to Scratch, and Hope being his daughter. Hope could possibly be a phony name, like many of the characters have. Who knows but Kc and his brilliant brain(s).

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Originally Posted by HaveCrowBarWillTravel

Attachment 1538Man oh man... the skids thing.. Arthur you are right my man. We went round and round and around about the copters and posted tons of pictures. Several were posted about the JGG and yes, that puppy has wheels. It only has one door and that's on the right side. Nothing to hold on to other than the "fins."
Next theory...

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Damn CrowBar! I missed all the Helicopter talk LOL!

I'm not sure what the guys are going to find at Irwin. I've been there a couple three times. The "Tanks" there are visually modified (VisMod) tanks to look like Soviet era tanks... that means that they take M-113 and put a fiberglass turret on it and take some PVC pipe and make it a tank "cannon". They'd be fine for driving through the hordes of the undead but not much for the way of killing them. Most of the ammunition there is going to be blanks that they use for the huge desert wide laser-tag game they play there. I'm sure that they won't be wanting for ammo though as the guys that are stationed there need to qualify on an annual basis. I'm pretty sure that they've upped the ammount of live fire exersizes they do there as well.

All in all I can't wait to hear what happens tomorrow!

[QUOTE=nikvoodoo;33414]Well I for one think Crowbar sounded like a dick.....

Just joshin'!!

ROFL STHU Voodoo! You don't know how many times I rewrote that and it was still hard.

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Originally Posted by IamPaul

I have been thinking the same thing about her being somehow related to the Mallers. Or possibly Kalani being a former Maller or acquaintance to Scratch, and Hope being his daughter. Hope could possibly be a phony name, like many of the characters have. Who knows but Kc and his brilliant brain(s).

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Huh? Huh? and HUH?? related to the mallers? Kalani's daughter? HUH?

So I guess I have to defend myself in the face of the ass kicking my theory received on the We're not Dead podcast...it's going to be hard to stand up against rhetoric that includes fancy sounding french labels :)
I maintain that Michael has changed and Kc is suggesting to us that there is calamity on the horizon. No doubt any sort of traumatic event such as, say the tower falling and crushing everyone in the process including (possibly) his buddy Angel, would be a catalyst for change which was poignantly communicated through the collective emotional breakdown in Chapter 25. But there is more at stake here...and I feel that I wasn't clear enough in my argument. So, this narcissistic horn tooting will hopefully reanimate my thwarted ideas.
The 'black ops' landing I referred to was their first crash by the farm house, not at the fort. Michael's erratic behavior was comical as he spilled out of the chopper, ordered Kelly and Tanya to stand watch and waited "with his finger on the trigger, sweat pouring down his face staring at a field of nothing". His unrealistic demands of Datu and the sarcastic comments from Kelly highlighted the supercharged delusions of Michael. I agree that this in itself would not give weight to the theory that Michael is loosing 'it' but when taken in context of all his other behavior in this chapter I think there has been a significant change in his character. Not so much that there is a brand new sparkling Michael completely different from the previous one, but maybe more in the sense that Michael has been broken down to his base elements in an unstable way.
The other observation that was debunked in the podcast was Michael's slow reaction at the Fort. When the (zombie?) appeared and the shot was fired, I am assuming that the smoking gun was in the hands of Datu. It has been keenly observed that Michael didn't have a handgun at this moment and the only one that can be accounted for is the same gun that Datu shot the zombie off the chopper with. If this is the case then it is odd that a member of the group would act without Michael's say so, which is to say, did Michele hesitate long enough that someone else (Datu...or other) felt they had to stand up and make a decision without Michele consent. If so, then this is evidence of Michael's crumbling ability to lead, the groundwork of which has already been laid by his ever constant reluctancy to be the defacto leader of the tower.
Michael is confused, unstable and erratic. He is lost in himself. Take for example his confession that "Maybe I was wrong" about repressing emotions by trying to keep busy. Everyone is being rational and Michael is a mess. He couldn't even take charge of Riely when she burst out of the chopper demanding where Angel is. Someone else had to step up and say what Michael couldn't.
Taken into consideration with the other examples from my previous post I think a rich tapestry of an impotent and confused Michael is evident.

My prediction after all of this...Michael and the group will discover a group of soldiers at the fort and he will fall into the role of leader. He will be back in familiar territory, commanding soldiers instead of friends, which is the respite he needs in this time of confusion. He will detach from the group, finding comfort and solace in his new role, eventually taking sides with the fort people over the tower group. Michael will become what he always was. A soldier.

"I worry more about you all than I did my soldiers back in the day"
"Thats a good thing"
"Yea?"

This will all be a echo of the role Michael was asked to play at the compound with the gatekeeper back in Season 2, but this time Michael has been shattered and will run into the arms of the army for comfort.

Here's the thing about Michael being a soldier and taking charge of soldiers. He's an E-5, or as we call them, buck sergeant. In my job (Infantry) a sergeant is in charge of no more than 4 other soldiers. I agree he'll enjoy being back in a structured environment with military rules and regulations, but he'll have a boss and his boss will have a boss, and ultimately none of them are in charge of anything because there's always an officer in charge of everything. I know that if the world went crazy while I was off post, the last place I would return to after months of being out on my own with my own people would be a military post. I'm a SSG and I wouldn't want to go back after having about 2 platoons of people under me. Also, the military has a great way of keeping people out if we want to, but those same things keep people trapped inside. I've been to Fort Irwin plenty of times, and I know that place with one infected person would turn into complete chaos. It's just too remote. I'll stick with nomadic living until I find another place I can secure, like the tower but more ground level.