Chapter 41-2 Eye Of The Storm

[nikvoodoo]

Break ends tomorrow! Hope you had a great holiday!

[werewolf]

Break ends tomorrow! Hope you had a great holiday!

will be glad to get back to work. yea I said it.

[LiamKerrington]

Holiday has been so exhausting - looking forward to seeing some relaxation in the monotony of the wagesslave's life again ...

[Kc]

Surprise! Episode is up now.

[daveyman23]

listening now. oh gosh thanks KC!

[Tielurrdee]

I stayed up refreshing my feed and it worked out ha woo hoo. I'm unsure what to say at this moment I don't want to spoil anyone not hearing the episode just yet

[daveyman23]

I stayed up refreshing my feed and it worked out ha woo hoo. I'm unsure what to say at this moment I don't want to spoil anyone not hearing the episode just yet

All I can say is.... FINALLY!

[Gooer]

Oh man, that caught me off guard. Better wake up and go listen to it....

[7oddisdead]

so I get off work at 3am...thinking im just going to bed, and boom! I <3 you right now, kc!!!



edit* I don't think anyone EVER predicted that....

[LiamKerrington]

Downloading ... listening ... Since this is out of the regular schedule, I won't go havoc on the VIP Chat ...

[LiamKerrington]

WHAT????????????? (at about Minute 6+ ...)

Dark spot ... Dark blue shirt ... Brown colored pants ... "Go!"

*DundunDUNNN!*

[7oddisdead]

this is so big I refuse to post anything for a few hours...but dammit its hard!

[LiamKerrington]

All I can say is.... FINALLY!

Yes.

[LiamKerrington]

And nice to hear his voice again, too ... Was some time since the last time ...

[Gooer]

God damnit, he's been put into a prison...

P.S. Not reading the other posts until i've listened to all of the episode....

[LiamKerrington]

I don't want to spoil anything more ... but ...
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the description of his nose ... !
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Hilarious!

[Gooer]

God damnit it was Randy after all...

[Gooer]

Wait, Angel and Saul knew Randy? Damn... And he's saying he could of done something about it..... The theories about Michael having the chance to take him out and not doing anything were right...

Like how Randy was excited about Saul making it, and not Angel...

[Gooer]

Where have i heard that voice before...

[LiamKerrington]

God damnit it was Randy after all...

I hope you have recognized this detail: Michael described him as being "a hell of a smart guy" (14:28). So, Randy has become a Smart One ...

[LiamKerrington]

Where have i heard that voice before...

My first thought was: Skittles. But Skittles appeared way after the Water Works ...

[Gooer]

Well that's how he broke his arm....and all about Randy's origins/turning.... Michael pussied out and now we know the consequences... Least we know Randy is known to be classed as a Smart one.. Damn what an episode.

[smalls kenobi]

the wait has been so long for this.. i'm getting chills listening to it.

[Gooer]

Randy at first reminded me of Skittles, but then i remembered it was Randy. I then thought it was Marcus or Gatekeeper, but then again, reminded myself it was Randy, and that I needed to be less stupid.

P.S. Sorry, i'm terrible, always post little posts instead of massive ones, i'm bad at thinking a lot at once...

[Footbutt]

So being a Smart One... means you still have some volition?
Randy said "Hi(?)" <BITE> then, "Go" <some sort of struggle> then, "Leave".
that sounds like a Zed that is in control of the choices he's making and is capable of issuing commands/instructions.

This interaction made me think of a scene in one of the Halo Books "Silentium" where an ancient forerunner 'colony' matriarch imbeds her genetic coding (or a means to communicate) with the Librarian via... biting her on the arm.

i know it's just a coincidence, but could Randy be trying to "communicate" with our human faction? Does being a Smart One also mean you keep your 'good nature' as well?

[LiamKerrington]

So being a Smart One... means you still have some volition?
Randy said "Hi(?)" <BITE> then, "Go" <some sort of struggle> then, "Leave".
that sounds like a Zed that is in control of the choices he's making and is capable of issuing commands/instructions.

...

i know it's just a coincidence, but could Randy be trying to "communicate" with our human faction? Does being a Smart One also mean you keep your 'good nature' as well?

According to Skittles the Smart Ones are nearly as worse as Ink are; he considers them to have a high threat-level compared with other zomboes.
Burt also mentions that there are Smart Ones which seem to be more threatening than the usual zombos, 'cause they are capable of thoughtful actions instead of simply reacting to situations like regulars do.

So I feel inclined to say: No!

But: since they are capable of thinking and using at least some parts of their knowledge and maybe even wisdom, I think it is not impossible for remaining some "good conscience" or act "good" - at least to a certain degree.

So my question is: WHY did Randy want R2Da2 to leave? He sure as hell recognized R2Da2 not turning as quickly as we are used to seeing humans turn into zombs. Did Randy tell him to go and to leave, because he expects R2Da2 to turn while within the human colony and thus having the chance to turn the human community into zeehs? Or did he allow R2Da2 to get the chance to being treated by Tanya or at least receive some medical treatment? Or maybe something else?
We should not forget: When Randy caught Tanya, Tanya was not slain; instead them zombos took her and wanted to carry her somewhere. Why? Maybe the reason for this might be the same or something similar motivating Randy to keep R2Da2 alive ...

Best wishes!
Liam

[Gooer]

I thought that Randy told Datu to "Get up", or a long those lines, not "Leave". As to why he only bit him and didn't outright kill him, maybe Randy knows that Datu will be turned into a Smart one, as Datu said to Victor when repairing the Pelican "I'm lucky i'm the smart one".....

Also, with Michael not being able to shoot Randy when he was turning, I would think it would be near impossible to shoot someone that you've been friends with for a long time, while it wouldn't when it is someone you don't know, like Fernando. Unfortunately, Michael would not know Randy would do the damage that he has been apart of....

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

So, there is still one big question remaining:

What happened to Pegs beforehand in order to give Michael the chance to tell his "Breaking Bad"-tale uninterrupted?

Hm...

http://www.tv-scripte.de/buffy/scripts/5-21/02.jpg

[Grognaurd]

Wow, thanks KC!

I never served... Is the, I do not know what to call it, animosity, contempt, disdain, bravado, clique, between officers and enlisted men so great that Randy would not affirm gladness that Angel lived?

Again, we see the small world kismet in effect. Five million people in LA and a off the roughly 50 named survivors, Randy is someone known by the original three. Maybe Michael has to know Randy from before to demonstrate a bond and have Michael not kill him.

But since it is such a small world, I always leave the door open for something more nefarious.

The US Army does not get called up for local law enforcement. We got people being eaten, so I can suspend some disbelief, but in my mind it is easier for a rogue element to call up a few people than it is for the massive legal bureaucracy to get moving. There are just so many levels of crap that the system has to churn through to get an order to Angel, Michael and Saul

They get called really early. Unless there is a conspiracy to contact them, we have to believe that events on the ground go up the chain of command of local law enforcement, filter to federal government, back to the military and back down to boots on the ground.

So, is Randy not surprised/Glad that Angel made it because of a conspiracy he knew was in place or just because of enlisted man bravado?

[scbubba]

Maybe Randy didn't really know Angel (not in the same unit) or he just didn't like him (very possible). Saul was a pretty gregarious, likable guy. Angel, maybe not so much and the added officer thing may have kept a distance between them since they were in different units.

Anyway, I'll have to listen again to see why Randy went to the base. Did he get called too? Or just decide that there was stuff there he might need?

I get the feeling that the call up was bigger than just Michael's unit (because the commander and a bunch of other soldiers were there and turned). Otherwise, I might think that Angel was acting separate from the chain of command for his own reasons. If multiple units were called in, then it's either a suspension of disbelief on a call-up or it's a much grander scheme that involved people higher in the chain....

[scbubba]

According to Skittles the Smart Ones are nearly as worse as Ink are; he considers them to have a high threat-level compared with other zomboes.
Burt also mentions that there are Smart Ones which seem to be more threatening than the usual zombos, 'cause they are capable of thoughtful actions instead of simply reacting to situations like regulars do.

So I feel inclined to say: No!

But: since they are capable of thinking and using at least some parts of their knowledge and maybe even wisdom, I think it is not impossible for remaining some "good conscience" or act "good" - at least to a certain degree.

So my question is: WHY did Randy want R2Da2 to leave? He sure as hell recognized R2Da2 not turning as quickly as we are used to seeing humans turn into zombs. Did Randy tell him to go and to leave, because he expects R2Da2 to turn while within the human colony and thus having the chance to turn the human community into zeehs? Or did he allow R2Da2 to get the chance to being treated by Tanya or at least receive some medical treatment? Or maybe something else?
We should not forget: When Randy caught Tanya, Tanya was not slain; instead them zombos took her and wanted to carry her somewhere. Why? Maybe the reason for this might be the same or something similar motivating Randy to keep R2Da2 alive ...

Best wishes!
Liam

Knowing Randy's involvement now in Datu's attack, I'm beginning to wonder what Zombie Randy might know. Is he motivated by a hatred for Michael because of the Waterworks? Is he trying to help the human survivors in some way? Is he on Ink's side? Is he against Ink but not helping the humans (in it for his own purposes)?

Given Randy's interaction with Tanya way back when and now this time with Datu - I'm thinking Randy is working on helping the humans in someway and it centers on Tanya getting information about the nature of infection/turning....

[Gooer]

Wow, thanks KC!

I never served... Is the, I do not know what to call it, animosity, contempt, disdain, bravado, clique, between officers and enlisted men so great that Randy would not affirm gladness that Angel lived?

I think that people just weren't very fond of Angel, so the fact that Randy did not express any joy towards Angel is probably just that.


Again, we see the small world kismet in effect. Five million people in LA and a off the roughly 50 named survivors, Randy is someone known by the original three. Maybe Michael has to know Randy from before to demonstrate a bond and have Michael not kill him.

But since it is such a small world, I always leave the door open for something more nefarious.

The US Army does not get called up for local law enforcement. We got people being eaten, so I can suspend some disbelief, but in my mind it is easier for a rogue element to call up a few people than it is for the massive legal bureaucracy to get moving. There are just so many levels of crap that the system has to churn through to get an order to Angel, Michael and Saul

They get called really early. Unless there is a conspiracy to contact them, we have to believe that events on the ground go up the chain of command of local law enforcement, filter to federal government, back to the military and back down to boots on the ground.

So, is Randy not surprised/Glad that Angel made it because of a conspiracy he knew was in place or just because of enlisted man bravado?

Also, I'm assuming that Kc did this just so that the story could unfold, one of the instances where he can't keep to fact, otherwise it not make the story progress properly.

[Gooer]

Maybe Randy didn't really know Angel (not in the same unit) or he just didn't like him (very possible). Saul was a pretty gregarious, likable guy. Angel, maybe not so much and the added officer thing may have kept a distance between them since they were in different units.

Anyway, I'll have to listen again to see why Randy went to the base. Did he get called too? Or just decide that there was stuff there he might need?

I get the feeling that the call up was bigger than just Michael's unit (because the commander and a bunch of other soldiers were there and turned). Otherwise, I might think that Angel was acting separate from the chain of command for his own reasons. If multiple units were called in, then it's either a suspension of disbelief on a call-up or it's a much grander scheme that involved people higher in the chain....

Randy was called in too, but by the time he arrived at the base, it was already covered with the zombies that the original 3 attracted by the alarm they set off.

[smalls kenobi]

when it comes to Randy not acknowledging Angel; it's simple, he didn't care for Angel. Angel being a higher ranking officer with almost no field work and his sense of entitlement at the beginning surely is enough to make someone show little respect for him.

when it comes to Skittles saying that the smart ones are more aggressive and as bad as ink, that doesn't mean that Randy or any of the other smart ones are always aggro, remember that Skittles came to that conclusion from personal experiences, i'm sure skittles didn't have a previous social bond with the smart ones beforehand. as far as they were concerned, Skittles is a nobody. and who knows the mental status of these smart ones, the bad ones could've been bad in life.

i believe they have somewhat of a grasp of consciousness, and the ones that follow ink chose to, i mean what else are they going to do try to join some regular humans? no way. they have their own kind now, stick with your own kind.

[smalls kenobi]

Damn, i haven't posted on this side of the forum in a long time, since season 2. it just occurred to me :^P

[scbubba]

Damn, i haven't posted on this side of the forum in a long time, since season 2. it just occurred to me :^P

Well, welcome back to this side! :D

[Gooer]

Damn, i haven't posted on this side of the forum in a long time, since season 2. it just occurred to me :^P

......The Dark side....?

[Gnex]

My first thought was: Skittles. But Skittles appeared way after the Water Works ...


Randy at first reminded me of Skittles, but then i remembered it was Randy. I then thought it was Marcus or Gatekeeper, but then again, reminded myself it was Randy, and that I needed to be less stupid.

P.S. Sorry, i'm terrible, always post little posts instead of massive ones, i'm bad at thinking a lot at once...


Ok............. So why does Randy have a line in the Wiki called "Skittles' Nickname" I looked a few other characters and didn't see anyone else who had this trait......................

[UndeadSweeper]

God damnit it was Randy after all... The theorists got it right!!!!!! Today you all get to wear the golden :tinfoil:

Micheal: Saul and Angel made, too
Randy: Great to hear Saul made.
Micheal: Angel too?!
Randy: Great to heard Saul made too.

No love for Angel LOL

[Gnex]

Michael has the world's worst timing...........

Someone just asked you to be the one to take care of them if they start to turn......... and you decide that it is the perfect time to tell him a story about the last time someone asked you to do that, and you just shut the door on them and left them........

[scbubba]

Ok............. So why does Randy have a line in the Wiki called "Skittles' Nickname" I looked a few other characters and didn't see anyone else who had this trait......................

Most of the Zombie wiki entries (other than Regulars/Normals) have a Skittles' Nickname section. This holds the nickname that Skittles gives to them when he's hanging out with his buddies (Angel and Kalani) from the Tower.

[Gnex]

Most of the Zombie wiki entries (other than Regulars/Normals) have a Skittles' Nickname section. This holds the nickname that Skittles gives to them when he's hanging out with his buddies (Angel and Kalani) from the Tower.

Yes, but I think it would be a lot better if Randy and Skittles were hanging out somewhere drinking Mojitos or something....... and Skittles was just like "You know Randy...... I think I'm gonna call you Handy Randy since your so good at fixing stuff........."

[Storm]

So my Little theory wasn't so far off after all... Randy and Mikey being so happy to see each other Again that they started dancing, which somehow went kinda wrong so Randy accidentally broke Mike's arm. Only part that turned out not to be true was the dancing one I guess.
BTW, he can't be Skittles, Bob's not listed in the credits for this episode. I thought that too, though, he kinda sounds like him. Anyway, he's an awesome guy! I'd love more flashbacks with human Randy.

[HardKor]

Wow, here I am thinking I'm on the ball, ready to download the new episode the moment it comes out, and its been out for 7 hours. Time to play catch-up!

So we finally get the Randy story. All in all the story turned out how I expected: Michael finds Randy in the waterworks, they scramble to get out, Randy gets chomped and Michael breaks his arm in a door while trying to reach out. I did not expect Randy and Michael to know each other from before the outbreak. That was interesting but We're Alive is a small world after all.

What's sticking in my mind now is: what is the significance of Randy being the one to bite Datu? I think that has to serve some purpose apart from getting Michael to tell his story.
I'll admit, I was skeptical at first, but I'm starting to buy into the idea that Randy is The Starscream (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheStarscream) to Ink. If Randy has just enough of his humanity left to want to fight against what he's been turned into then maybe he could study whatever Ink is doing to look for a way out. And since he left Datu after biting him, maybe Randy will end up being the one who both infects and saves Datu.

[Gooer]

Ok............. So why does Randy have a line in the Wiki called "Skittles' Nickname" I looked a few other characters and didn't see anyone else who had this trait......................

Think because he is a zombie, all zombie characters have a section for Skittles' nickname, such as smart ones, fast ones, etc

Edit: Just realised its been answered already, woops!

[Gooer]

Michael has the world's worst timing...........

Someone just asked you to be the one to take care of them if they start to turn......... and you decide that it is the perfect time to tell him a story about the last time someone asked you to do that, and you just shut the door on them and left them........

Hahaha.....just thought about that.

[Gnex]

Hey Michael...... we are going out of town for the weekend and wanted to know if you would watch the house for us???

Sure thing!!! But First let me tell you a little tale about the last time I watched someone's house...... Everything was going great and then the whole place burned to the ground...... But yeah, No problem... Have a great trip!!!

[Bullethead]

Not as much traffic on this episodes thread. I mean come on people you finally have the answer to "Who is Randy?"

Now I've only listened to the episode once, at work, so I may be missing a few things I would usually catch. I am guessing Randy has discovered a way to keep people from turning, or perhaps that his bites don't turn people, maybe if you bite them in a certain spot (both Tanya and Datu in the arm right?), when the moon is full, between the hours of 1800-2300, with a 3-7mph wind gust from the west or something.

I am also going to guess that Randy is the one who got to Tanya before we found her. Maybe he knew who she was from before the outbreak, he seemed to be excited over hearing about Saul. They could have been ol chums.

He appears to be marking his targets. My guess is so that other biters don't attack them, or he is giving them a strain of his blood since he is clearly different. Better Randy then a mindless Z tearing them to pieces.

Now just need to figure what he's selecting these people for. What does he have in mind? Ultimate payback for Michael not shooting him ? Ha?

[Tar Heel Fan]

It's interesting that Randy was bitten by a regular one - it doesn't take a smart one to make a smart one, just need that one to already be smart, apparently. That info doesn't exactly help us to know what is going on with Datu.

However, what I think MIGHT be significant: Randy's eyes changed pretty much right away, if I heard that right. And if I recall, a big part of Michael's hesitancy to do anything to Datu was that his eyes were not yet changed. A smart one does not necessarily have to be a slow turner, which I guess I was assuming - their process would be different than normals'. Perhaps Datu will have the same kind of immunity as Tanya and Saul have shown?

[Tar Heel Fan]

Thinking about the eyes . . . it's also interesting that despite the eyes already turning, Randy was still able to talk and think and be in control of himself. It makes me wonder: What is the point of "Zombieness"? What are those symptoms of the moment when the person ends and the zombie begins - the transition that Datu is fearing? Tanya may have found that moment in the blood with the K18 levels, are there other physical absolute indicators . . . And will Michael be able to interpret those signs correctly in order to do right by Datu (if) when the time comes? (Oh, I hope he doesn't get trigger-happy to make up for his past mistake)

[Gooer]

Not as much traffic on this episodes thread. I mean come on people you finally have the answer to "Who is Randy?"

Now that we know, we don't have anything to theorise about......it's just there in front of us...


I am also going to guess that Randy is the one who got to Tanya before we found her. Maybe he knew who she was from before the outbreak, he seemed to be excited over hearing about Saul. They could have been ol chums.

I'm afraid, it was a slow turner that the colony captured, not Randy, that bit Tanya.

[Bullethead]

I'm afraid, it was a slow turner that the colony captured, not Randy, that bit Tanya.

Wasn't sure if that was confirmed or not. Tanya likes to leave out details at her discretion.

[Gooer]

Wasn't sure if that was confirmed or not. Tanya likes to leave out details at her discretion.

Nope, pretty sure it was confirmed, due to the fact that they put down the partly-turned slow turner inside of the colony. Meaning (unfortunately) it wasn't Randy

[Storm]

Michael will just go "oh, fine then, I better not screw it up this time!" and just give Datu the needle righte after he's done telling the story. You know, then he's sure it's before he's turned. :)

[Tar Heel Fan]

So my question is: WHY did Randy want R2Da2 to leave?

AWESOME question - as cliche as it sounds: do zombies have a finer sense of other peoples' brains? Can they sense someone who is going to be able to be a "smart one" or a slow turner?



He sure as hell recognized R2Da2 not turning as quickly as we are used to seeing humans turn into zombs. Did Randy tell him to go and to leave, because he expects R2Da2 to turn while within the human colony and thus having the chance to turn the human community into zeehs? Or did he allow R2Da2 to get the chance to being treated by Tanya or at least receive some medical treatment? Or maybe something else?

Liam, you got some great thoughts there, and if the smart zombies are all on the same team as Ink, your first question fits in with some of the strategic maneuvers we've seen from the smart ones (see the slow turner up at the Ft. Irwin). I'll throw out a maybe something else, though:

Is it possible that Randy, with his ability to maintain certain human capabilities (decision-making, "reading," tool use (the list), speech), actually has some memory of what it's like to be human and his process of changing and took pity on Datu? Offered Datu the chance that he never got - to put an end to it before turning into a zombie? There's clearly something very different about Randy and Ink verses the tattooed, numbered ones (who seem like they were artificially experimented with, turning them into what they are). It's a bit :tinfoil:, but that's how we get through the week, isn't it?

[UndeadSweeper]

Wow, here I am thinking I'm on the ball, ready to download the new episode the moment it comes out, and its been out for 7 hours. Time to play catch-up!

So we finally get the Randy story. All in all the story turned out how I expected: Michael finds Randy in the waterworks, they scramble to get out, Randy gets chomped and Michael breaks his arm in a door while trying to reach out. I did not expect Randy and Michael to know each other from before the outbreak. That was interesting but We're Alive is a small world after all.

What's sticking in my mind now is: what is the significance of Randy being the one to bite Datu? I think that has to serve some purpose apart from getting Michael to tell his story.
I'll admit, I was skeptical at first, but I'm starting to buy into the idea that Randy is The Starscream (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheStarscream) to Ink. If Randy has just enough of his humanity left to want to fight against what he's been turned into then maybe he could study whatever Ink is doing to look for a way out. And since he left Datu after biting him, maybe Randy will end up being the one who both infects and saves Datu.

Yes, my Starscream theory :excited:

[LiamKerrington]

Hell, yeah. Starscream ... I like this picture.

And, guys and girls, I happened to decide it would be time for a new poll:

http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?5092-Poll-Time-again-Will-Michael

Enjoy it!
Best wishes!
Liam

[scbubba]

WHY did Randy want R2Da2 to leave?

Best wishes!
Liam
I'm beginning to wonder if Randy said "Leave!" or if he might have said (let me get my :tinfoil: on just right now) "Live!"

Randy gives the "Bite of Life" to Datu because he (Randy) has figured out that something in his body can be used to inoculate a person against zombie cooties....

I may or may not be having an off day today..... :squint:

[Gnex]

I think Datu is delusional.............. 1 minute he is on deaths door, next minute he almost sounds like someone just told him a joke, then the next minute he can't remember anything, then all of a sudden he remembers everything...............

I think Datu is going to be fine.... He is just in shock and doesn't know how to handle it.......

Next Episode after having his blood taken every 2 hours, Tanya is going to tell us all that Datu's numbers are actually going backwards...... and then they start trying to figure out why!!!! :squint:

[Gnex]

I'm beginning to wonder if Randy said "Leave!" or if he might have said (let me get my :tinfoil: on just right now) "Live!"

Randy gives the "Bite of Life" to Datu because he (Randy) has figured out that something in his body can be used to inoculate a person against zombie cooties....

I may or may not be having an off day today..... :squint:

The way I am hearing it..... it sounds like this.......

The other Zombies are closing in on Datu.
Randy says "Mine"
Then Sounds like Datu is Attacked(Bitten) Maybe Randy pulls him away from another Zombie at this point????
Then Randy tells the other Zombies to "Go"
Then Sounds like Datu gets Attacked(Bitten) again???
Then Randy says "Leave" and runs off. (Seems like he is talking to himself in this one, maybe forcing his zombie brain to actually leave Datu???)


I can't really figure out the 2 "attacks/bites"..... Seems like Datu yells out, Randy says "Go", then Datu yells out Again.....????

The Second yell sounds much worse so I am guessing that is the Bite...... but what is the first???

[Gooer]

I think Datu is delusional.............. 1 minute he is on deaths door, next minute he almost sounds like someone just told him a joke, then the next minute he can't remember anything, then all of a sudden he remembers everything...............

I think Datu is going to be fine.... He is just in shock and doesn't know how to handle it.......

Next Episode after having his blood taken every 2 hours, Tanya is going to tell us all that Datu's numbers are actually going backwards...... and then they start trying to figure out why!!!! :squint:

Hopefully...would be funny if it happened, but I doubt it *sigh*

[Merlin1274]

Finally we get the Randy Story..

Now we can focus on something else.

[Witch_Doctor]

this is so big I refuse to post anything for a few hours...but dammit its hard!

That's what she said.

[LiamKerrington]

The WA community is so much in shock and awe about at least one and a half mysteries solved in a single event (Michael's broken arm, a lot about Randy), that this thread starts stalling way too early ...

[Witch_Doctor]

Ok............. So why does Randy have a line in the Wiki called "Skittles' Nickname" I looked a few other characters and didn't see anyone else who had this trait......................

I'm guessing that a Skittles' Nickname is how Skittles described the special zombies e.g. Little One, Behemoths, Super Fasties and Brains. Whoever edited Randy's wiki page may have assumed that he was his own class of special zombie.

[Gooer]

The WA community is so much in shock and awe about at least one and a half mysteries solved in a single event (Michael's broken arm, a lot about Randy), that this thread starts stalling way too early ...

That, and a long with the fact it was similar too last episode, there isn't much analysis of stuff to talk about, like the chemicals/Ink's jail sentancing/Cowen etc. But, it's good we finally got the story on how 1)How Michael's arm was broken and 2) how Randy is known.

Personally, i like how that they knew Randy before the events that occurred after, instead of them just meeting at the water station for the first time, with the same result (as i saw those theories too)

[cringebot]

What juicy ep! Human Randy seemed like a cool guy. I didn't expect to have any emotional connection hearing him turn and abandoned, but I really felt bad. Props to the voice actor.

So, Michael indirectly killed Datu.

My theory is that Z Randy may have a personal vendetta against Michael and wants him to finally kill someone close to him. Randy did mention seeing them from the waterworks, so maybe he saw Datu and Z Randy recognized him. Datu also asked Z Randy to finish him off, just like he did to Michael.

Maybe Z Randy is smart enough to help the humans. Maybe he grabbed Tanya because he somehow saw she was medical. He also had the chemical bottle, giving Michael clues.

Whatever it may be Z Randy has some kind of memory of his human life.

[7oddisdead]

Alrighty then!

first of all, I'm not sure how I feel about Randy being datus attacker. On the one hand, that only makes sense in the story if Randy is there for a specific purpose, be that nefarious or well intended. On the other hand, lets think of the ground hes had to cover to get from the location Michael & co. Saw him last to going down to the colony. Not to mention the fact that whatever the follistatin errand was, it was connected to a job for ink. the way I see it has not changed from last episode. However KC handles this I'm interested to see, but I have my reservations. I know its a "small world" but it could get tooooo small.

its been mentioned already, but I tend to agree with the idea of Randy being a catalyst for an end. I have to wonder, if we have saul/tanya...with seeming immunity, why could the other side not have one in the group with non-transferable infection? Also, we know that bill has experimented with growth hormones, follistatin, etc, could he not have experimented with Randy to give him that? Just because bill is seemingly evil does not mean his ends are not magnanimous.

I dunno, I'm semi confused at this point. Typing on my phone sucks....more later

[Witch_Doctor]

Hey, didn't Pete tell Victor that the zombie that attacked him was wearing a brownish shirt? Datu tells Micheal that the zombie that attacked him was wearing a dark blue shirt. Probably just eye witness unreliability.

[Witch_Doctor]

We have another time stamp. Michael describes the events of the Water Works as being about a month and a half from the, May 8th, beginning of the outbreak. Also, Randy has no idea just how long he was in the water works.

[Eviebae]

Soooooo good. We have a quest. I told her (edited to add: "she" is my visiting sister) it would be intense and she may not like to hear it. She said she wouldn't mind listening to it, but then preceded to chat with my husband...sacrilege! I ended up putting on the headphones to spare me!

How many zomboids attacked Datu et al and how do we know? I had thought just one. I thought it attacked Glen and devoured him. Then attacked Datu (just a bit), before turning on Jay. After Jay ran out of bullets, it bit him and then turned back to Datu. Then the zomboid left and Jay turned. Datu was hanging off of Jay begging him to kill him and then when he didn't he shot Jay with the air gun. Is that what happened?




We've only seen Randy with a group of zomboids once, right? I can't tell if he's good or bad (in relative terms) but it seems like he might be a renegade of some sort. Maybe he'd just like to rule in hell than serve in Inks master plan.

[Witch_Doctor]

Soooooo good. We have a quest. I told her it would be intense and she may not like to hear it. She said she wouldn't mind listening to it, but then preceded to chat with my husband...sacrilege! I ended up putting on the headphones to spare me!

Huh?



How many zomboids attacked Datu (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showwiki.php?title=Datu) et al and how do we know? I had thought just one. I thought it attacked Glen and devoured him. Then attacked Datu (just a bit), before turning on Jay (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showwiki.php?title=Jay). After Jay ran out of bullets, it bit him and then turned back to Datu. Then the zomboid left and Jay turned. Datu was hanging off of Jay begging him to kill him and then when he didn't he shot Jay with the air gun. Is that what happened?
We've only seen Randy (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showwiki.php?title=Randy) with a group of zomboids once, right? I can't tell if he's good or bad (in relative terms) but it seems like he might be a renegade of some sort. Maybe he'd just like to rule in hell than serve in Inks master plan.



He was with the group that snatched Tanya.
He was seen outside the Colony by Victor, but was joined later by others. (We don't her anything about his involvement in the attack, itself, though.)
Not sure if you can count the zombies that jumped from the alley to attack Puck as part of a group with him.

It is interesting to note that he was in the presence of an Inkling when Datu was attacked. It seems a bit too difficult for me to justify Randy being a rogue at this point. What do you think?

[7oddisdead]

Not necessarily.

keep in mind the reason mike n co went to raydon is Randy, they ended up killing a little one there. Also, here in our scene with datu, Randy was there....and we now have another dead little one.

likely? No...but possible

[Witch_Doctor]

Are you suggesting that Randy may be leading the Little Ones into situations where they would be killed by the humans?

[7oddisdead]

Nnnaaaawwwww.....why would I say something like that???


:hsugh:

[REZombie]

Hmmmm.... Random thought for the day, and probably not right...but this whole scenario ran through my head..... In listening to when R2Da2 got bit...it kinda seems like it was purposely infecting him and not trying to kill him...then it really does sound like "Get Up" in a zombie voice. Had thought...What if that "get up" was meant as "Get up, you are ok"? Has R2Da2, ever seen or heard about Randy? Could Randy have infected him? I have a feeling that Randy is up to something, and i honestly don't think its in Inks best interest. We know he is running around with chems in a bag, he was interested in Tanya...maybe he has figured out who will or wont turn, and knows it will give a huge advantage to the "good guys"..and aside from showing them, its not like he could just walk up and explain it, they cant talk that well and plus they'd kill him.

With the cover art, something has to tie in to either going back or hearing Micheal's story...What better why then if R2Da2 mentions something about the biter that bit him and Micheal recognizing it as Randy and thus leading into the story....



Looks like i was right on the money with the bold part! :D



Wow....need to listen a bit more to process, lol...

[poniesandzombies]

Unit- wherever you are you are a genius and I am glad I jumped on your tinfoil hat theory bandwagon last week!! I even told the We're Alive fan cast guys on their Facebook page before I listened to this week!! I bet they mention how smert you are!!!

[Elisa]

Extremely enjoyable episode. Finally we get the Randy/Michael story. Kudos to the peeps who figured it out. I love that KC tried to steer us away from Randy being involved with Datu. So nice to hear Angel's voice again and to see a more human side of Michael

[Gooer]

It was only the recorded episode of Angel's voice, wasn't new recording unfortunately...
As for the group that attacked Datu Glenn and Jay, i believe it was Randy, a Little one, and a regular, with the last two being shot down. I'm assuming the one that i heard screaming in the distance at 17:39 on 40-3 was Randy, but not sure. Could of been another Little one in the vicinity of the area....

[nikvoodoo]

Man. What a worthless episode. Nothing at all interesting or clarifying in the slightest.

Why did my nose just grow 3' long?

Well worth the wait!

[scbubba]

Not necessarily.

keep in mind the reason mike n co went to raydon is Randy, they ended up killing a little one there. Also, here in our scene with datu, Randy was there....and we now have another dead little one.

likely? No...but possible

I've been going back and forth for the last 24 hours between Randy as an agent of Ink vs Randy as a helper of humans. Your little idea here doesn't help me decide in the least.... ;)

I do kinda like the idea of Randy playing the "teams" off against each other. We know he would have a good motive to want Michael's team to suffer. I'm also thinking Randy has had more than one run in with Ink given his involvement with the folistatin and the tattoo on his face (wait, is it a tattoo on Randy's face?). Maybe that's given him motive to want Ink's team to go down hard too.

Or, like you say 7odd, maybe Randy is using Team Human to deplete the forces of Team Ink....
Randy following Glen and Pete to the Colony and tipping off Ink.... Maybe
Randy dropping hints to Michael and the soldiers to get them to Raydon and then tipping off Ink.... Maybe
Randy knowing about the well at the Colony and then tipping of Ink.... Maybe

I almost wonder if there is a way to tie Randy to Victor and Tanya's adventure back to Ground Zero and Lucky #7....

[Footbutt]

i'm going to assume that Randy's biting of Datu was completely intentional to the last detail.
(from what it sounds like...)
Randy (possibly) waits for the sidearms to be emptied
He calls Datu as 'his' - "Mine!"
Randy drags him away from the group, then bites him
He then orders Datu to "Go."
Datu doesn't move, so Randy pulls him along (Datu thinking he's taking him away)
Randy finally says "Leave" and jets, leaving Datu alone

to me, it sounds like Randy is trying to keep his 'turning' of Datu kinda secrect, or at least partially hidden from the other Zombies. Maybe this is some sort of 'cry for help'? from TOWTM? i don't know.

Keep in mind, the words spoken by Randy could also have been for his minion-Zeds. "mine", "go", "Leave", are all pretty basic and to the point commands.

[Footbutt]

I've been going back and forth for the last 24 hours between Randy as an agent of Ink vs Randy as a helper of humans. Your little idea here doesn't help me decide in the least.... ;)

I do kinda like the idea of Randy playing the "teams" off against each other. We know he would have a good motive to want Michael's team to suffer. I'm also thinking Randy has had more than one run in with Ink given his involvement with the folistatin and the tattoo on his face (wait, is it a tattoo on Randy's face?). Maybe that's given him motive to want Ink's team to go down hard too.

Or, like you say 7odd, maybe Randy is using Team Human to deplete the forces of Team Ink....
Randy following Glen and Pete to the Colony and tipping off Ink.... Maybe
Randy dropping hints to Michael and the soldiers to get them to Raydon and then tipping off Ink.... Maybe
Randy knowing about the well at the Colony and then tipping of Ink.... Maybe

I almost wonder if there is a way to tie Randy to Victor and Tanya's adventure back to Ground Zero and Lucky #7....

solid analysis!
that last part makes me lean heavily towards Zombie Factions and a rift between them. Could one be vying for dominance while the other wants peace? (funny way of showing it.)

[Grognaurd]

We have another time stamp. Michael describes the events of the Water Works as being about a month and a half from the, May 8th, beginning of the outbreak. Also, Randy has no idea just how long he was in the water works.

Yea, I think we can nail down Michael's visit and that Randy has been there a while. CJ does not send him there because the water failed, she sends him there so it does not fail completely after they notice a drop in pressure. The most interesting aspect of this is that CJ sends people o the waterworks, but after Dunbar is attacked, she opts to fly solo rather than check to see if they are there.

Maybe... KC may be with holding part of CJ's story.

[LiamKerrington]

The whole Randy-thing is - again - a certificate showing how excellent Kc tells a story. We already know quite a lot about Randy. His background is almost covered. But the one important bit misses for us to answer the question, whether he is on par with the humans or with Ink's army. And the devilish thing about it: you can perfectly well argue in favor of both (and even more) theories.

If he acts on behalf of the humans, what does this tell us about zombies being humans or none-humans?

Best wishes!
Liam

[Grognaurd]

He was with the group that snatched Tanya.
He was seen outside the Colony by Victor, but was joined later by others. (We don't her anything about his involvement in the attack, itself, though.)
Not sure if you can count the zombies that jumped from the alley to attack Puck as part of a group with him.

It is interesting to note that he was in the presence of an Inkling when Datu was attacked. It seems a bit too difficult for me to justify Randy being a rogue at this point. What do you think?

Victor says, ... And he's brought friends... So, I do not think he was alone when he discovers the colony.

I think the inklings could mop the floor with a normal. Bigger, stronger, faster. I wonder if killing the inkling gave Randy the option to behave differently. The inklings have scratched in the past to turn people. Most of the normals seem to bite.

I have some really crazy thoughts here that are not even half baked :tinfoil: so, going to hit the pause button

[nikvoodoo]

The whole Randy-thing is - again - a certificate showing how excellent Kc tells a story. We already know quite a lot about Randy. His background is almost covered. But the one important bit misses for us to answer the question, whether he is on par with the humans or with Ink's army. And the devilish thing about it: you can perfectly well argue in favor of both (and even more) theories.

If he acts on behalf of the humans, what does this tell us about zombies being humans or none-humans?

Best wishes!
Liam

So what this argument boils down to is "Trust Snape" or "Don't Trust Snape"

I like both sides to the argument. Randy is trying to help Michael by giving him evidence and facts to help him in his struggle against Ink.

I also really really like the idea of Randy tracking Michael to the ends of the Earth to torment him for not doing what needed to be done. That's one hell of a dynamic to have contained within a villain.

[Elisa]

I don't know. Just a gut feeling but I still think Randy is working for Ink, his right hand man, just trying to bring down the enemy and eliminate the humans. I just don't think he is a double agent.

[Gooer]

I'm not sure if Randy is a double agent - he's a zombie, why would he want to save the humans? But then again, it's possible - maybe he knows what he is, and wants to save the humans from it...

[Verse]

A few things I thought were interesting. Randy's eyes got cloudy really fast and Datu has yet to have them. Still bothers me that Datu has yet to talk about Hope. I know it is a minor complaint, but just makes me wonder. Last we heard of her was Tanya going "You treat him better!" then nothing else. Also disappointed. I know it is easy to say "I would do it" when none of us have been in that position he was in with Randy and is with Datu.

I don't think it was much malice with Randy toward Angel. I think it was half joke and half serious. He didn't wish he was dead or disliked him to the point he was like "Really. I really really wanted him to die just because I am not fond of him. God. I wish he had really died" and more making a joke about not liking him. His tone was more of a joking one than a "Shit... I was hoping he died"

SIDE NOTE:

I didn't post much last part due to work, but I find it very very interesting that Jay didn't attack Datu. Going back to Skittles saying they only really attack wach other when hungry. Also that Saul and Tanya have been attacked. Jay not attacking tells me that they know when someone is one of them or not, and that Tanya and Saul are not.

[Gnex]

So what this argument boils down to is "Trust Snape" or "Don't Trust Snape"

I like both sides to the argument. Randy is trying to help Michael by giving him evidence and facts to help him in his struggle against Ink.

I also really really like the idea of Randy tracking Michael to the ends of the Earth to torment him for not doing what needed to be done. That's one hell of a dynamic to have contained within a villain.

Never trust Snape!!! or CJ!!!! :)

[Storm]

Never trust Snape!!! or CJ!!!! :)
So... CJ kills Michael in the end???

[Red Shirt]

I never served... Is the, I do not know what to call it, animosity, contempt, disdain, bravado, clique, between officers and enlisted men so great that Randy would not affirm gladness that Angel lived?

Not necessarily officers per se, just incompetent and impersonal ones. Officers in the military, like the Enlisted are a mixed bag. It must be said that:

I have had the honor to serve with and for some of the best that the Army has had to offer. Men and Women who embody the spirit of the Officer's Corp's, live the Army Values and truly believe in the welfare of the soldiers under their command... that being given the command of soldiers is not a task to be taken lightly, not is it one to be taken lightly. I was once even been reminded of (then) Lieutenant Colonel Moore (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Were_Soldiers_Once%E2%80%A6_And_Young) and I would have taken a bullet for him.

I have also experienced the unique displeasure of "serving" under incompetent, self-serving, even corrupt amateur politician hypocrites that were only in it for the next promotion. I have at least been able to bear witness to one get "passed over" for promotion. Twice.


The US Army does not get called up for local law enforcement. We got people being eaten, so I can suspend some disbelief, but in my mind it is easier for a rogue element to call up a few people than it is for the massive legal bureaucracy to get moving. There are just so many levels of crap that the system has to churn through to get an order to Angel, Michael and Saul

They get called really early. Unless there is a conspiracy to contact them, we have to believe that events on the ground go up the chain of command of local law enforcement, filter to federal government, back to the military and back down to boots on the ground.

So, is Randy not surprised/Glad that Angel made it because of a conspiracy he knew was in place or just because of enlisted man bravado?

This. ^^ This in spades.

Suspension of disbelief to get the characters into the story, write what you know... Kc was a reservist... OK, I'll buy that for a dollar.

But you're right. The mobilization of Federal Troops for what initially seems to be a matter of civil unrest is a far stretch. Not to mention that doing so skirts dangerously close to violation of several sections of the US Constitution and a lot of (I believe) USC Title 10. This is a matter that is more inline with the responsibilities of the National Guard. Mobilization of Reservists would require the order of either the President or Congress where the mobilization of the Guard would only need orders from the Governor. The thing is, even the Guard is a stretch. SHTF in LA, but the capitol is up in Sacramento. Buy the distance scale of the east coast that is three to four states away. How would the governor know to mobilize that fast, from that far away.

I've mused this point before and it leads me to believe that "The Families" had something to with it and/or had some form of prior knowledge of the event that were to unfold. I posit that "The Families" are of the ancient, secret society type with designs on bringing about the NWO. Angel knew this and disagreed, the reason he was on the outs with The Families. When SHTF, he knew what was happening and although it would be unlikely he could stop it, he had to do something. He called the CO and lied that Battalion called him because they couldn't reach him. It was all for not though, in the end all he got was two soldiers and himself.


I'll admit, I was skeptical at first, but I'm starting to buy into the idea that Randy is The Starscream (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheStarscream) to Ink. If Randy has just enough of his humanity left to want to fight against what he's been turned into then maybe he could study whatever Ink is doing to look for a way out. And since he left Datu after biting him, maybe Randy will end up being the one who both infects and saves Datu.


Now just need to figure what he's selecting these people for. What does he have in mind? Ultimate payback for Michael not shooting him ? Ha?

Don't forget the cover art for Chapter Four (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=2612&d=1374686559) and the speculation behind it (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?4600-Season-4-Artwork-Speculations).

[Grognaurd]

Yea, I am a fan of the families and conspiracy. To that I also add that Angel has his ring with him. If it was simply something that tied him to organized crime, I do not think it is something to have with normal day to day activities. But, a birthrite from a new world order once it starts...

[Witch_Doctor]

We see more of Datu's religious side. He refuses to do the deed himself because of the unforgivable nature of suicide. He has even put thought into to his situation. He wants to die BEFORE he turns and not after. It seems that, with the exception of Tommy, zombies are not able to make this and carry out this decision. When Micheal suggests that Datu do it himself, he says that he can't. I think Datu came to this conclusion by comparing his knowledge of his impending horror to the knowledge of any other impending hardship. If it is a sin to commit suicide because you feel that you cannot endure an illness, grief, poverty or any other hardship of the human condition, then turning would fall into this category.

I've thought about what happens to one when they are turning and whether it would be best to die before, knowing that your death is coming, or die in a blaze of glory afterwards, when it seems that you're no longer rational and full of rage. What goes on in the minds of the turned? How much of their humanity is left? By humanity, I don't mean simple compassion and decency, but the self awareness that is at the center of one's consciousness. Are you trapped inside, watching yourself commit gruesome acts? Are you repulsed by the things you do as if some other agent has control of your actions? Stuffing human flesh down your throat as if the gears that connect your free will to your means of acting have been stripped, and your limbs are dangling from marionette strings controlled by some internal puppet master.

Are you simply gone?

[Gooer]

I'm currently typing up the episode onto the wiki, and i got to the part where Datu thinks Randy said something to him. Randy definitely tells Datu to "Go". It then sounds like Randy pats down Datu, as if searching for something, then says something else, but I can't figure out what he is saying....

[Witch_Doctor]

I have to hand it to all the We're Alive talent for doing such a great job, buuuuuttttt................. I'm gonna rib Jim Gleason a bit for his screaming in pain in this episode. :rolleyes:

Here is a new poll to pick the We're Alive Scream Queen.

http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?5098-Vote-for-the-title-of-WE-RE-ALIVE-SCREAM-QUEEN

[Tielurrdee]

We're alive a story of how Michael Cross kills the rest of humanity with his poor decisions

[COsurvivor]

Every decision we make have unexpected consequences.

RIP Datu

But I would Bite Michale for being a little bitch

[Unit]

One :tinfoil: theory I just thought about. What if Randy saved Michael somehow at the waterworks but got bit/scratched in the process; he asks Michael to shoot him so he doesn't turn into a zed but Michael can't stomach to shoot his savior (similar to how he won't shoot Datu now even though the other soldiers want to). Randy turns and Michael feels guilty that he let him turn into a zombie and others have died because he couldn't pull the trigger before. Now he is trying to right his own wrong, but he can't tell anyone because then people would blame him for some of what is happening. And we know Michael doesn't like to take blame (jambalaya MRE wrapper anyone? Didn't read Carl's report about little ones turning people into other little ones?)

Finally, I get one of my theories right :)


A new episode comes out and gets released early even, and I still don't get a chance to listen to it for a few days... you just can't win.


I am glad to get clarification on what happened to Michael's arm and background on Randy. I see a lot of people talking on here about Randy maybe siding with the humans and I can't seem to get my head around that. How do the actions of Randy show that he may be siding with the humans? Trying to take Tanya, attacking the Colony, biting Datu.... where/how have any of his actions benefited the humans? KC is amazing and we may find out later that that is true and I just can't seem to get above it all and see the whole picture, but for now it just doesn't seem logical.

I am hoping that the tests on Datu's blood reveal something important that show that Datu is not in fact turning, or is turning REALLY slowly. Datu says that he will fix the water pump, but he wants Michael to take him out before he has a chance to turn. That is a balancing act of how long to let him work and when to pull the plug.

I find the change in Puck's attitude interesting. Last time they seemed pissed at Michael for not blowing Datu's head off on the spot. Now he seems sympathetic and even volunteers to help draw his blood? People's mind and moods can change but it just seemed a pretty drastic swing of the pendulum. Maybe he just is seeing what Michael was feeling, or maybe he wants Datu around now after hearing CJ's story about the water situation and so he gets why we still need King Datu to finish the job. I don't know.

[Witch_Doctor]

Great, now we know the Randy story, but what about the arena? Did Datu 'look away' from the hockey rink or did he she what happened or was about to happen to Samantha?

[Red Shirt]

Yea, I am a fan of the families and conspiracy. I that I also add that Angel has his ring with him. If it was simply something that tied him to organized crime, I do not think it is something to have with normal day to day activities. But, a birthrite from a new world order once it starts...

Here's a thought running in the vein of "identification." From Chapter 29, part 1/3 at 5:18:

Kimmet: "...but before we get to that point, I'm going to need your ID. I was told you brought it. Have it on ya?"
Michael: "Yeah. Here."
Kimmet: "Surprised you still had this. Good thing, because we don't have access to records."
Michael: "We were planning on coming here. It would have been stupid to leave it behind."

A hint?

If we are to go down the NWO conspiracy rabbit hole, it seems to me that like Michael's ID card, Angels ring could have served him as "identification" that granted him access to refuge.

[ZombieWildfire]

i'm going to assume that Randy's biting of Datu was completely intentional to the last detail.
(from what it sounds like...)
Randy (possibly) waits for the sidearms to be emptied
He calls Datu as 'his' - "Mine!"
Randy drags him away from the group, then bites him
He then orders Datu to "Go."
Datu doesn't move, so Randy pulls him along (Datu thinking he's taking him away)
Randy finally says "Leave" and jets, leaving Datu alone

to me, it sounds like Randy is trying to keep his 'turning' of Datu kinda secrect, or at least partially hidden from the other Zombies. Maybe this is some sort of 'cry for help'? from TOWTM? i don't know.

Keep in mind, the words spoken by Randy could also have been for his minion-Zeds. "mine", "go", "Leave", are all pretty basic and to the point commands.


the other side of this is that Randy purposefully bites Datu and tells him to "go", meaning go back into the colony, where he would turn and potentially ruin their safety. Perhaps Randy knew that Datu would be a slow turner, giving him a better chance to infiltrate the colony first before he turns. Or perhaps it is just Randy's bad luck that Datu is such a slow turner that they've all worked out what is going on and have a plan in place. Perhaps Randy knows that his bite will cause slow turning, which is why he wanted Datu for himself, or perhaps he couldn't trust the normal biters to not kill him entirely.

I actually really hope that this isn't the case, and that indeed Randy is in some way shape or form, on the side of the survivors. But its a possibility I suppose.

Which ever side he is on, it is clear that Randy retains a degree of humanity which many of the others don't seem to have. I guess we just have to wait and see what happens to Datu from now on.

I'm assuming the worst- its the only way to cope with the emotional roller coaster ride that is WA!

[ZombieWildfire]

I find the change in Puck's attitude interesting. Last time they seemed pissed at Michael for not blowing Datu's head off on the spot. Now he seems sympathetic and even volunteers to help draw his blood? People's mind and moods can change but it just seemed a pretty drastic swing of the pendulum. Maybe he just is seeing what Michael was feeling, or maybe he wants Datu around now after hearing CJ's story about the water situation and so he gets why we still need King Datu to finish the job. I don't know.

I'd go with the initial calls to kill Datu as being down to sheer fear and self-protection. Then, his attitude changes as the adrenaline wears off and he sees that they are not in immediate danger. I think it would be hard for anyone to witness Datu's situation and not be touched. I've been thinking "What would I do in that situation?" and the main answer I have come up with is "PANIC LOTS AND CRY MORE", whereas Datu, who is known for being a but hysterical in the past, is actually being quite stoical and brave about the whole thing. Puck and the others would pretty definitely be thinking 'there but for the grace of god go I', and that's got to be pretty sobering.

[7oddisdead]

the other side of this is that Randy purposefully bites Datu and tells him to "go", meaning go back into the colony, where he would turn and potentially ruin their safety. Perhaps Randy knew that Datu would be a slow turner, giving him a better chance to infiltrate the colony first before he turns. Or perhaps it is just Randy's bad luck that Datu is such a slow turner that they've all worked out what is going on and have a plan in place. Perhaps Randy knows that his bite will cause slow turning, which is why he wanted Datu for himself, or perhaps he couldn't trust the normal biters to not kill him entirely.

!

randy= the shittiest henchmen ever.

i mean really, think about it. IF he is just doing "what the boss says" then how have any of his assignments been successful? bonered up the raydon run, didn't bring Tanya to the hospital, didn't get a slow turning datu to go back to the colony, i dunno....just makes him out to be a bad Scooby doo villain imo.

while i have no clue what side he may fall on, we do know inklings will kill regulars. so i stand behind the 'getting humans to kill inklings' thing. survival of the fittest, and if your not the fittest...be the most cunning.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

randy= the shittiest henchmen ever.

i mean really, think about it. IF he is just doing "what the boss says" then how have any of his assignments been successful? bonered up the raydon run, didn't bring Tanya to the hospital, didn't get a slow turning datu to go back to the colony, i dunno....just makes him out to be a bad Scooby doo villain imo.

while i have no clue what side he may fall on, we do know inklings will kill regulars. so i stand behind the 'getting humans to kill inklings' thing. survival of the fittest, and if your not the fittest...be the most cunning.

Oh, I think you are too harsh on Randy. The truth is, people like us, we love henchmen. There would not be 23 / 24 (Never Say Never Again) / 25 (Casino Royale TV movie) bond films if there had been at least one proficient henchman. What about all the legions of storm troopers who are abysmal bad at shooting?

First and foremost, people tend to neglect the fact that most henchmen are just Joe Average type of guys.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ag_AFraxj-4

[Unit]

So awesome haha

[tonyhind86]

I'm so far behind in this forum lately, its almost criminal!

Has anybody mentioned the theory yet that perhaps Randy bit Datu to save him from being attacked by the other biters?

[Witch_Doctor]

I'm so far behind in this forum lately, its almost criminal!

Has anybody mentioned the theory yet that perhaps Randy bit Datu to save him from being attacked by the other biters?

I don't remember anyone suggesting this theory, exactly, but it sounds intriguing. Do, go on.

[tonyhind86]

I don't remember anyone suggesting this theory, exactly, but it sounds intriguing. Do, go on.

I've seen the theory that Randy may have retained some of his humanity - either he felt sorry for Datu laying there crying, or perhaps he knew he would be a slow turner or even saw him as a non-threat. I'm glad we've only got 4 days till the next episode so we can hopefully get more answers.

I'm also hoping to see a confrontation between Ink and Randy so we can find out how their relationship dynamic functions. If my thinking is correct, I don't believe we've seen them in the same place at the same time.

[UndeadSweeper]

randy= the shittiest henchmen ever.

i mean really, think about it. IF he is just doing "what the boss says" then how have any of his assignments been successful? bonered up the raydon run, didn't bring Tanya to the hospital, didn't get a slow turning datu to go back to the colony, i dunno....just makes him out to be a bad Scooby doo villain imo.

while i have no clue what side he may fall on, we do know inklings will kill regulars. so i stand behind the 'getting humans to kill inklings' thing. survival of the fittest, and if your not the fittest...be the most cunning.

Someone doesn't understand the greatness* of having henchmen.

2908

*Forgive me for my error. :)

[wh33t]

Finally! Michaels revelation about his arm didn't disappoint!

[7oddisdead]

?"the greatest of having henchmen"?

does not compute.

[Gooer]

What i want to know now is, how will Datu take the information Michael just gave him. Will he be sympathetic, or will be blame what happened to him on Michael?

[Storm]

I've seen the theory that Randy may have retained some of his humanity - either he felt sorry for Datu laying there crying, or perhaps he knew he would be a slow turner or even saw him as a non-threat. I'm glad we've only got 4 days till the next episode so we can hopefully get more answers.

I'm also hoping to see a confrontation between Ink and Randy so we can find out how their relationship dynamic functions. If my thinking is correct, I don't believe we've seen them in the same place at the same time.

We have, I think... Chapter 35, when he brings friends to the colony... Ink definitely is there since he orders the Little ones around in 36.
But besides that I can't remember any other place they've been together.
I like the idea of Randy trying to help the humans though.
Oh, and another thing. As I remember, someone mentioned Randy's eyes as getting clouded. Michael never says anything about that, he just says "Hey! Your eyes... Your eyes are..." and then goes back to whine about his arm. Of course he could have tried to say "Your eyes are getting kinda cloudy, dude, guess you're turning" but why would he want to do that? As far as I remember, they've only seen zombies with cloudy eyes at that point (chapter 8) so it's just normaly that your eyes do that. They haven't met any slow turners either, so he wouldn't just be able to think that "oh, they're gonna get cloudy in a few minutes". It sounds more likely to me that he'd point out the fact that they stayed normal, since pointing out what's normally happening is kinda pointless...
"Oh, Datu! You just kicked that bucket filled with Water! Now the floor is wet!" ... See? Pointless...
"Oh, Datu! You just kicked that bucket filled with Water, but nothing has happened!" ... Makes much more sense... Ehh... Maybe not, but anyways! I didn't sleep that much this night, forgive me for not coming up with a better example. :D

[Gooer]

We have, I think... Chapter 35, when he brings friends to the colony... Ink definitely is there since he orders the Little ones around in 36.
But besides that I can't remember any other place they've been together.
I like the idea of Randy trying to help the humans though.
Oh, and another thing. As I remember, someone mentioned Randy's eyes as getting clouded. Michael never says anything about that, he just says "Hey! Your eyes... Your eyes are..." and then goes back to whine about his arm. Of course he could have tried to say "Your eyes are getting kinda cloudy, dude, guess you're turning" but why would he want to do that? As far as I remember, they've only seen zombies with cloudy eyes at that point (chapter 8) so it's just normaly that your eyes do that. They haven't met any slow turners either, so he wouldn't just be able to think that "oh, they're gonna get cloudy in a few minutes". It sounds more likely to me that he'd point out the fact that they stayed normal, since pointing out what's normally happening is kinda pointless...
"Oh, Datu! You just kicked that bucket filled with Water! Now the floor is wet!" ... See? Pointless...
"Oh, Datu! You just kicked that bucket filled with Water, but nothing has happened!" ... Makes much more sense... Ehh... Maybe not, but anyways! I didn't sleep that much this night, forgive me for not coming up with a better example. :D

I think he was going to say Randy's eyes were going cloudy, as a note/confirmation that he is in fact turning. "Oh shit, your eyes are going cloudy! You're going to turn!" That kinda thing...

[Footbutt]

?"the greatest of having henchmen"?

does not compute.

*greatness

?

[poniesandzombies]

I'm so far behind in this forum lately, its almost criminal!

Has anybody mentioned the theory yet that perhaps Randy bit Datu to save him from being attacked by the other biters?

That is kind of a thought that came to me.... Maybe there was a little one or something there and that is where the scratches on Datu's face. But perhaps why Randy is taking the stuff from Raydon to make an antidote he is testing on himself and he bit Datu to counter act the scratches... Complete crazy tinfoil I know... But the thought did cross my mind...

[UndeadSweeper]

That is kind of a thought that came to me.... Maybe there was a little one or something there and that is where the scratches on Datu's face. But perhaps why Randy is taking the stuff from Raydon to make an antidote he is testing on himself and he bit Datu to counter act the scratches... Complete crazy tinfoil I know... But the thought did cross my mind...

Another question, how does Randy end up at Raydon Labs, then the alley and now the Colony? How close is his base of operations?

[shadrak]

The heightened keratin 18 levels are a result of an inoculation process. Randy has some control of his original mental faculties (it seems the higher the intelligence, the more control the original personality has) and his attack on Datu has the potential to inoculate him. Randy is at odds with Ink and has left a trail of bread crumbs for the characters to follow.

IF the disease agent is unable to complete the turning process, the victim's immune system will develop antibodies and conditions that prevent turning in the future. Also, individuals who are turned by disease agent 1 (the origianl strain) are not susceptible to the mutated strain (which creates the "little ones"). It appears that Ink has a hand in creating the mutated strain and needs new human subjects to infect. This explains why he is so careful in his attacks on the characters...he does not have total control of the other zombies and he needs to reduce fatalities or type-1 zombie conversion. We do not know why he wants to do this, but a smaller zombie population is more sustainable, and due to his narcissism and necrosis, he probably considers his modifications an improvement on normal human life.

A side effect of the new strain is that it makes the infected even more susceptible to cancer. Ink is trying to develop something that will reduce these problems.

[shadrak]

Yea, I am a fan of the families and conspiracy. To that I also add that Angel has his ring with him. If it was simply something that tied him to organized crime, I do not think it is something to have with normal day to day activities. But, a birthrite from a new world order once it starts...

"The Family" is neither organized crime (well, in a sense it is), nor is it a new world order. It is, literally, a family...as in, like gypsies. Families/tribes that sustain themselves through low level crime and odd jobs.

[shadrak]

Wow, thanks KC!

I never served... Is the, I do not know what to call it, animosity, contempt, disdain, bravado, clique, between officers and enlisted men so great that Randy would not affirm gladness that Angel lived?

Again, we see the small world kismet in effect. Five million people in LA and a off the roughly 50 named survivors, Randy is someone known by the original three. Maybe Michael has to know Randy from before to demonstrate a bond and have Michael not kill him.

But since it is such a small world, I always leave the door open for something more nefarious.

The US Army does not get called up for local law enforcement. We got people being eaten, so I can suspend some disbelief, but in my mind it is easier for a rogue element to call up a few people than it is for the massive legal bureaucracy to get moving. There are just so many levels of crap that the system has to churn through to get an order to Angel, Michael and Saul

They get called really early. Unless there is a conspiracy to contact them, we have to believe that events on the ground go up the chain of command of local law enforcement, filter to federal government, back to the military and back down to boots on the ground.

So, is Randy not surprised/Glad that Angel made it because of a conspiracy he knew was in place or just because of enlisted man bravado?

Good catch on the call up...the reserves are not the national guard....

However, this can be explained away by having a Commander call in forces to get accountability, protect government/military assets, or (with special authority) respond to a natural disaster. It is interesting so few unit members made it to the armory when it is described as a very large armory--possibly because of zombie infiltration or because the order to assemble wasn't official?

Regarding Angel, it's not so much bravado as it is not caring about a shake and bake officer/glorified private and Randy not having a relationship with him. It seems Randy is much more concerned about Saul than he is about Michael...Michael is a soft-skill POG and Saul is a grunt....Engineers are closer to grunts than they are MI (which tend to have an over inflated opinion of their contributions to mission effectiveness). And as far as soft-skill, PAO is about as soft as you can get.

[shadrak]

Yes, but I think it would be a lot better if Randy and Skittles were hanging out somewhere drinking Mojitos or something....... and Skittles was just like "You know Randy...... I think I'm gonna call you Handy Randy since your so good at fixing stuff........."

Also, wasn't Skittles a part of KCs tower? He may have recognized Randy

[Alec]

Also, wasn't Skittles a part of KCs tower? He may have recognized Randy

Yea Skittles is Duncan that was in The First Tower with CJ

[Storm]

Also, wasn't Skittles a part of KCs tower? He may have recognized Randy

He was indeed. Question is if they have seen each other/will... Or maybe Hope will recognise him, her losing her sight and still being alive has to mean something special!

[Alec]

He was indeed. Question is if they have seen each other/will... Or maybe Hope will recognise him, her losing her sight and still being alive has to mean something special!

Skittles hasn't been seen (or mentioned) in 3 months, story time. Do you think he will show up?

[Elisa]

The heightened keratin 18 levels are a result of an inoculation process. Randy has some control of his original mental faculties (it seems the higher the intelligence, the more control the original personality has) and his attack on Datu has the potential to inoculate him. Randy is at odds with Ink and has left a trail of bread crumbs for the characters to follow.

IF the disease agent is unable to complete the turning process, the victim's immune system will develop antibodies and conditions that prevent turning in the future. Also, individuals who are turned by disease agent 1 (the origianl strain) are not susceptible to the mutated strain (which creates the "little ones"). It appears that Ink has a hand in creating the mutated strain and needs new human subjects to infect. This explains why he is so careful in his attacks on the characters...he does not have total control of the other zombies and he needs to reduce fatalities or type-1 zombie conversion. We do not know why he wants to do this, but a smaller zombie population is more sustainable, and due to his narcissism and necrosis, he probably considers his modifications an improvement on normal human life.

A side effect of the new strain is that it makes the infected even more susceptible to cancer. Ink is trying to develop something that will reduce these problems.

Wow This ^^ does make a lot of sense. Awesome analysis shad

[Gooer]

Also, wasn't Skittles a part of KCs tower? He may have recognized Randy

Due to Skittles' mental health, i doubt he would properly recognise him. Although, the second time we met him, he was doing better; maybe now he is fully recovered? Also, we haven't been shown an instance where Skittles has seen Randy, with or without anyone with him, so it may appear unimportant to him if he had of seen him - it's just another smart one, no need to bring up the details of exactly that one?

[Alec]

Due to Skittles' mental health, i doubt he would properly recognise him. Although, the second time we met him, he was doing better; maybe now he is fully recovered? Also, we haven't been shown an instance where Skittles has seen Randy, with or without anyone with him, so it may appear unimportant to him if he had of seen him - it's just another smart one, no need to bring up the details of exactly that one?
True but he did recognize Kalani.

[Grognaurd]

The heightened keratin 18 levels are a result of an inoculation process. Randy has some control of his original mental faculties (it seems the higher the intelligence, the more control the original personality has) and his attack on Datu has the potential to inoculate him. Randy is at odds with Ink and has left a trail of bread crumbs for the characters to follow.

IF the disease agent is unable to complete the turning process, the victim's immune system will develop antibodies and conditions that prevent turning in the future. Also, individuals who are turned by disease agent 1 (the origianl strain) are not susceptible to the mutated strain (which creates the "little ones"). It appears that Ink has a hand in creating the mutated strain and needs new human subjects to infect. This explains why he is so careful in his attacks on the characters...he does not have total control of the other zombies and he needs to reduce fatalities or type-1 zombie conversion. We do not know why he wants to do this, but a smaller zombie population is more sustainable, and due to his narcissism and necrosis, he probably considers his modifications an improvement on normal human life.

A side effect of the new strain is that it makes the infected even more susceptible to cancer. Ink is trying to develop something that will reduce these problems.

Um, you are not KC trolling us with an alt are you?

Infection by biter 1.0 does seem to prevent upgrading to inkling. Otherwise, I am sure Ink would have done so. There is an abundance of examples of a similar virus giving immunity to a similar pathogen. The reason "milk maids" were so desired by rampaging knights is that the milk maids got cowpox. This protected them from the much more nasty scaring caused by Smallpox which leaves a much greater number and more severe scars.

[Gooer]

True but he did recognize Kalani.

But he easily had his mind changed - both Angel and Kalani convinced him that they hadn't met, making Skittles start to doubt whether he actually had met him before...

[Unit]

Michael considered Randy a friend and he didn't recognize him until he heard Randy's voice if I am not mistaken. Who knows if skittles even knew Randy in Dunbar before Randy got sent out to the Water Works too. Randy said he had been there for a while. Given all the factors I would doubt Skittles would recognize or remember Randy even if he saw him up close.

[Grognaurd]

When Dunbar falls, Randy and some others are probably at the water works. CJ is hiding in the basement. Skittles says he is going to try and rescue them.

Kilani is being held hostage and a group tries to come rescue them. Samantha was part of this. She is not killed and taken hostage.

The other dude with Kilani, I forget his name. Says there he goes. I do not know what he means. Could it be Skittles running away from the rescue group? He survives and the others are killed. Could it be Ink going all physical bad ass and charging the people with guns and killing them?

Anyway, the water works group is there maybe two to three weeks, but some how Ink's group finds them and kills them. This seems to damage the pumping station or the people there and the water goes out. Causing the investigation by Michael, Angel, Riley and Datu.

Something else that is interesting is Cindy goes missing at this time. The biters either dig her up or does she dig herself out? In either case, I am perplexed. There are 5 million dead, why is ths corpse important?

We make the assumption that this is our world, just with Zombies sprinkled on top. There is something else that is much darker in this world. Something being held at the Mental Hospital so terrifies Angel, that he thinks it is perfectly natural to call up the army reserve to kill it.

After they kill Cindy, Michael needs a cig. He says, I lost people today also, you do not see me breaking down. Strange.

Where I go nuts is I am not sure which little things I am supposed to let go for the point of story telling and those that are lose ends that help us unravel what is actually occurring.

[Gooer]

When Dunbar falls, Randy and some others are probably at the water works. CJ is hiding in the basement. Skittles says he is going to try and rescue them.

Kilani is being held hostage and a group tries to come rescue them. Samantha was part of this. She is not killed and taken hostage.

The other dude with Kilani, I forget his name. Says there he goes. I do not know what he means. Could it be Skittles running away from the rescue group? He survives and the others are killed. Could it be Ink going all physical bad ass and charging the people with guns and killing them?

Anyway, the water works group is there maybe two to three weeks, but some how Ink's group finds them and kills them. This seems to damage the pumping station or the people there and the water goes out. Causing the investigation by Michael, Angel, Riley and Datu.

Something else that is interesting is Cindy goes missing at this time. The biters either dig her up or does she dig herself out? In either case, I am perplexed. There are 5 million dead, why is ths corpse important?

We make the assumption that this is our world, just with Zombies sprinkled on top. There is something else that is much darker in this world. Something being held at the Mental Hospital so terrifies Angel, that he thinks it is perfectly natural to call up the army reserve to kill it.

After they kill Cindy, Michael needs a cig. He says, I lost people today also, you do not see me breaking down. Strange.

Where I go nuts is I am not sure which little things I am supposed to let go for the point of story telling and those that are lose ends that help us unravel what is actually occurring.

Pretty sure Skittles ran from dunbar, in his crazed state of mind, and next finds Angel Riley and Datu. Also, when he says "there he goes" he is talked about Kalani falling in/out of consciousness, due to him being hit too hard by a zombie.

Also, not sure what Michael was talking about. His parents died during one of his tours, and he was an only child. Unless he means other relatives, i assume its a script error....

[Witch_Doctor]

But he easily had his mind changed - both Angel and Kalani convinced him that they hadn't met, making Skittles start to doubt whether he actually had met him before...

Skittles is highly susceptible to the Jedi Mind Trick.

[Grognaurd]

Pretty sure Skittles ran from dunbar, in his crazed state of mind, and next finds Angel Riley and Datu. Also, when he says "there he goes" he is talked about Kalani falling in/out of consciousness, due to him being hit too hard by a zombie.

Also, not sure what Michael was talking about. His parents died during one of his tours, and he was an only child. Unless he means other relatives, i assume its a script error....

My bad. It is Kilani. One serving of crow, please...

[Eviebae]

My bad. It is Kilani. One serving of crow, please...

Caw...

[LiamKerrington]

With plenty of luck little less than 20hours, but more likely something around 26 hours from now that #41-3 concludes the chapter of #41 ... Anyone at least hafl as excited as I am???

Best wishes!
Liam

[Unit]

I'm curious what crazy cliff hanger KC will leave us with this time... My money is on is Datu starting to change or not. He will be fixing the pump, he will make a funny sound or yell or something, all the crew yells his name and starts running towards him... and cut scene. Then we spend two weeks debating if he is turning or slipped and fell off the tower or something :)

[7oddisdead]

With plenty of luck little less than 20hours, but more likely something around 26 hours from now that #41-3 concludes the chapter of #41 ... Anyone at least hafl as excited as I am???

Best wishes!
Liam

I'll bet a ducat I'm at least half, possibly two thirds. Better yet, a bitcoin!

[LiamKerrington]

I'm curious what crazy cliff hanger KC will leave us with this time... My money is on is Datu starting to change or not. He will be fixing the pump, he will make a funny sound or yell or something, all the crew yells his name and starts running towards him... and cut scene. Then we spend two weeks debating if he is turning or slipped and fell off the tower or something :)

The interesting part here is: When Tommy was infected, he very quickly turned aggressive. And to me it sounds similar with Randy ...
R2Da2, though, becomes more and more sorry about himself and the world he's gonna leave ... Maybe this already points us towards what some of us already think and believe to happen: R2Da2 the ressourceful may surive after all, 'cause the zombie-agent is harmless against the hydraulic oils pumping through R2Da2s veins ...

[Witch_Doctor]

I'm curious what crazy cliff hanger KC will leave us with this time... My money is on is Datu starting to change or not. He will be fixing the pump, he will make a funny sound or yell or something, all the crew yells his name and starts running towards him... and cut scene. Then we spend two weeks debating if he is turning or slipped and fell off the tower or something :)


The interesting part here is: When Tommy was infected, he very quickly turned aggressive. And to me it sounds similar with Randy ...
R2Da2, though, becomes more and more sorry about himself and the world he's gonna leave ... Maybe this already points us towards what some of us already think and believe to happen: R2Da2 the ressourceful may surive after all, 'cause the zombie-agent is harmless against the hydraulic oils pumping through R2Da2s veins ...

During the first season, the cliff hangers didn't seems as anguishing as of late. (Then again, it could be that I was able to listen to back-to-back episodes without pause.) However, there were plenty of episodes that had more resolved endings.

[YetAnotherBloodyCheek]

I am afraid but R2Datu surviving seems too be to much of a Hollywood ending to me. It might sound harsh and inhuman. The same applies to Saul's and Tanya's fate.

[Grognaurd]

I do not know what will happen. I can see it either way. What we have in this universe is not typical. If we think that some sort of natural thing that belched from the Earth, we are befuddled by the large number of unburied dead that Saul and Victor found. So, lots and lots of people at ground zero did not seem to turn.

Typically we see a chain of infection distributed by bites. But, there does not appear to be five million biters running around LA.

Cindy turns and has two broken legs. She is not very mobile. Did something wound her, but not eat her? That is different from the dude in the garage. He gets munched, but does not reanimate. Did they bury the guy in the garage? The suicide gate guy? The other one they kill in the tower, but do not describe? If Cindy was not the only one buried, were the others also dug up?

Ink murders Paul. Paul does not reanimate. If Ink is compelled to grow his army, why does he kill rather than turn Paul? However, Ink then knocks nicely on the door instead of kicking it in and going after the other residents of the tower. Does he think he is a vampire and needs an invite into the apartment?

[Gooer]

I think that, unlike most zombies, like in The Walking Dead, where they just get up if possible after turning, no matter the state of the body, you still need to be somewhat alive to be able to turn in WA - having your throat chewed out, or being ripped apart, will mean you are no able to sustain the body, meaning the zombie will have no chance either. Remember, they still eat and sleep (maybe drink) like regular humans, so they need the body for them to be able to carry it out.

[Witch_Doctor]

I think most people and zombies eventually succumb to what ever wounds they have. They're not getting medical treatment for their injuries and open sores, and I'm sure there are other dangerous infections running rampant.

[shadrak]

I do not know what will happen. I can see it either way. What we have in this universe is not typical. If we think that some sort of natural thing that belched from the Earth, we are befuddled by the large number of unburied dead that Saul and Victor found. So, lots and lots of people at ground zero did not seem to turn.

Typically we see a chain of infection distributed by bites. But, there does not appear to be five million biters running around LA.

Cindy turns and has two broken legs. She is not very mobile. Did something wound her, but not eat her? That is different from the dude in the garage. He gets munched, but does not reanimate. Did they bury the guy in the garage? The suicide gate guy? The other one they kill in the tower, but do not describe? If Cindy was not the only one buried, were the others also dug up?

Ink murders Paul. Paul does not reanimate. If Ink is compelled to grow his army, why does he kill rather than turn Paul? However, Ink then knocks nicely on the door instead of kicking it in and going after the other residents of the tower. Does he think he is a vampire and needs an invite into the apartment?

Based on the clues in the episodes, we lean toward the following:
1. The "zombification" process occurs most normally using a human vector (zombified human), but likely can be acquired through other means (directly injected, airborne?).

2. Zombification requires a living host that remains living through the turning. Turning does not occur after dead like in TWD. I don't recall any "reanimation" in We're alive, I only seem to recall "turning" events. I could be missing some, though.

3. We know that bites (saliva?) introduce the pathogen into the body and cause turning. We assume that blood introduced into the body would do the same (open wounds, mucus membranes, etc), but we know that skin prevents infection.

4. Based on this, the "Zombification" pathogen in We're Alive seems to operate like most modern diseases...imagine a disease that causes a fast acting neurosyphilis and an extreme hunger. The original zombies of season one seem more similar to TWD Zombies, while the zombies post-season 1 are seem to be victims of a degenerative disease. It is possible that the disease also causes a mutation by modifying DNA at the cellular level.

5. We don't know whether the infection is viral, bacterial, or fungal, or if it is actually a disease. So far, the only indication of infection is heightened levels of Keratin 18 (how the good Dr. can make projections on speed of infection/transition based on information from 1 or 2 individuals).

6. Keratin 18 is a protein that is found almost exclusively in humans in simple epithelial cells, though, with genetic modifications, it has been taken up by complex epithelial cells. Heightened levels of Keratin 18 can also be an indication of cancer (related to tumors in the "Big Ones"--do the "normals" have tumors as well?)

7. Non-biological origin: The gas could be the origin of the disease and it could be a non-biological source that causes mental disfunction, but this is unlikely as it should not be contagious.

8. If the infection was engineered and was deliberately introduced in the population the gas may be something that was intended to weed out the non-infected. Perhaps the infection was a part of a weapons program either a botched superSoldier program or a biological warfare agent.

[Tielurrdee]

I think most people and zombies eventually succumb to what ever wounds they have. They're not getting medical treatment for their injuries and open sores, and I'm sure there are other dangerous infections running rampant.

I can dig this especially because the behometh was dead. I have another theory to add a thought really. What if the longer you are infected and turned the longer a bite from you takes to turn another person. I'm not going to push this theory but could this hold weight?????
Pretty sure Skittles ran from dunbar, in his crazed state of mind, and next finds Angel Riley and Datu. Also, when he says "there he goes" he is talked about Kalani falling in/out of consciousness, due to him being hit too hard by a zombie.

Also, not sure what Michael was talking about. His parents died during one of his tours, and he was an only child. Unless he means other relatives, i assume its a script error....
Ok some other post we're not right about stittles you all have some strange information on who you may think skittles is, this one was only partly correct. The incorrect part is that about skittles talking to kolani in the arena, that was a character named martin. As well the Michael thing about his parents was not a script error it was intentional. Michael has not always been upfront about his personal life early on because there are things and issues he just did not want to deal with or talk to people out he was pretty private about certain things. Kc has said something along thoes lines before. Anyways make sure you guys read are right about facts, I'm not getting on anyone about it hell I can be wrong at times too, but you don't want to confuse others on the boards.

[Gooer]

I can dig this especially because the behometh was dead. I have another theory to add a thought really. What if the longer you are infected and turned the longer a bite from you takes to turn another person. I'm not going to push this theory but could this hold weight?????
Ok some other post we're not right about stittles you all have some strange information on who you may think skittles is, this one was only partly correct. The incorrect part is that about skittles talking to kolani in the arena, that was a character named martin. As well the Michael thing about his parents was not a script error it was intentional. Michael has not always been upfront about his personal life early on because there are things and issues he just did not want to deal with or talk to people out he was pretty private about certain things. Kc has said something along thoes lines before. Anyways make sure you guys read are right about facts, I'm not getting on anyone about it hell I can be wrong at times too, but you don't want to confuse others on the boards.

I was referring to Martin when i said "There he goes", i just couldn't remember his name (probably should of written it a bit better). And they way Michael acted, it was as if his parents were alive when it started. If he didn't want to bring it up, he wouldn't of said anything, surely.

[LiamKerrington]

Based on the clues in the episodes, we lean toward the following:
3. We know that bites (saliva?) introduce the pathogen into the body and cause turning. We assume that blood introduced into the body would do the same (open wounds, mucus membranes, etc), but we know that skin prevents infection.


Amendment:
Litle Ones scratching their victims may start the zombification process as well. But here we have no intel on what exactly happens. I remember that Little Ones were described as having scratch-marks on their arms, but I am not certain (anymore). So I could depict something along that line: Little Ones scratch themselves in order to get blood or lymph-fluids under their fingernails; and when they scratch their victims, these get infected as well. But considering the quick spreading of Little Ones in Boulder I am not certain about this. So an alternative would be that Little Ones might establish kind of open woundings or even glands at their fingertips which in combination with scratchings from the fingernails would transfer the zombie-agent into the victim's body. Here some riddles need to be solved, but we lack the information to work with it.

Best wishes!
Liam

[Grognaurd]

It is clear that that "We're Alive" is a double entendre. The victim must survive to turn. Sometimes the initial wound prevents that from occurring. Other times, I think the corpse is heavily fed upon. If the body is going to change and become stronger and faster that requires calories to build up the muscles.

It is interesting that one of the drugs mentioned on the "shopping list" at Raydon Labs was something to increase appetite. The initial out break can be fueld by people insane with hunger and a cognitive dysfunction. Another interesting connection is the number of bites in the throat and the location of the thyroid gland which also plays a role in metabolism.

The gas could be an additional killing mechanism to weed out non-infected. But, it could be an area denial weapon. The biters 1.0 seemed to remove bodies from the tower, but seemed reluctant to do so from ground zero. There seems to be a difference but what is the motive?

1) bodies removed from the tower but not ground zero because the gas keeps them away.
2) the bodies removed from the tower are biters, is there something in their fallen comrades that makes them more desirable than just a fallen human?

[Footbutt]

2) the bodies removed from the tower are biters, is there something in their fallen comrades that makes them more desirable than just a fallen human?

i'm wondering about when the bodies were first taken away. was it "instinct" or were they following commands from TOWTM? Do the biters 'repurpose' fallen comrades?

[Jeebogs]

I've said it before and I'll say it again,

Randy is a 'good' guy.
Just because it seems he works for Ink doesn't mean he's not trying to lead Michael to the truth. He fears for his (undead) life.

Randy is the Zombie resistance.

[LiamKerrington]

I've said it before and I'll say it again,

Randy is a 'good' guy.
Just because it seems he works for Ink doesn't mean he's not trying to lead Michael to the truth. He fears for his (undead) life.

Randy is the Zombie resistance.

If people are correct and they hear a Little One together with Randy attacking Glenn, Jay, and R2Da2, then I wonder, how much Randy can be part of a zombie-type resistance; Little Ones are associated with Ink or Ink's army ... So I am not so certain that Randy is a zombie-resistance-guy; but I won't exclude this way of looking at it ...

[Grognaurd]

Ah, but that is the twist. By killing the litte one, Randy may be able to do something else. Little one scratches Datu to turn him into a little one. It is killed. Randy bites Datu. Biter 1.0 seems to turn pretty quick. Lil ones are slower to turn. Amy gets to the hospital. Some people drive from Denver to Ft Irwin.

[Unit]

I don't think the little ones always turn slow. When they are at Dominguez elementary don't Glenn and Pete say one of their friends Roman turns into a little right away?

[LiamKerrington]

Ah, but that is the twist. By killing the litte one, Randy may be able to do something else. Little one scratches Datu to turn him into a little one. It is killed. Randy bites Datu. Biter 1.0 seems to turn pretty quick. Lil ones are slower to turn. Amy gets to the hospital. Some people drive from Denver to Ft Irwin.

Well, in Boulder the Little Ones were damn quickly turning ... But you raise a very interesting question: Do the different zombie-agents cancel each other out? Or are there some inferior to others?

[Jeebogs]

If people are correct and they hear a Little One together with Randy attacking Glenn, Jay, and R2Da2, then I wonder, how much Randy can be part of a zombie-type resistance; Little Ones are associated with Ink or Ink's army ... So I am not so certain that Randy is a zombie-resistance-guy; but I won't exclude this way of looking at it ...

That's just the point, he's hiding in plain sight. In order to fight from within, Randy can't raise too many suspicions. He is double agent Randy (or perhaps Snape, to use nikvoodoo's analogy)

[Gooer]

I think it's all different. Sometimes they change quickly, sometimes they change fairly slowly, maybe due to different factors, such as the depth of the cut, the type of cut, whether bite or scratch, or maybe due to something about the target, such as blood type....

[Zombie Yeti]

This may have been said. But relistening to this chapter and the interaction between datu and randy. I think randy wanted datu to tell micheal so micheal will come after randy. Randy will lead micheal to some discovery