Chapter 30- Short Term Memory Part 3

[nikvoodoo]

So...do our heroes (and Pete....the bitchy water boy ;) ) escape their predicament? Will Saul discover the Sat phone? Will Glenn get another communications erection from it?

Will Victor ever find love?

All these questions and more will be answered on this weeks episode!

And by all these questions, I mean maybe one of them. Possibly none....

Enjoy the episode, and to all the Fathers: Happy Belated Father's Day!

[Chogidog]

New epi is out!

[HardKor]

I loved hearing Saul in the background looking through the backpack "Hey, a phone....broken in half" So much for using the satellite phone to contact Michael.

[reaper239]

ahhhhhhhh, zombie crack. so good. if cj pulled that crap on me i'd have slapped her.

[ZomNom]

Awesome. So, Saul and the crew now know that Michael and the rest of the gang probably made it to Ft. Irwin. Why else would they be sending recon missions out to LA? This could get interesting. With CJ convinced it's a suicide mission to go at the Conlony by themselves ... I suspect they plan on calling in the Cavalry.

[Merlin1274]

That was a frustrating Episode. Nothing Happened. Least we know CJ is upset with Saul. Phone is nogo. But they have a lead that Fort Irwin is Operational.
But not much meat in this episode for me. But the old guy seems to know something about the numbers. Maybe he will remember..

[Chogidog]

LOL @ 10:05... "Porno"

[Lukas A.]

I think cj might just like Saul... She hesitated when: she says "your just my tennants" saul says" is that all we are to you?" *hesitation* "yes". And if u listen closely, cjs voice shakes a tiny bit when saul calls her "one cold bitch", but then she quickly regains control of her emotions. She also says "what about me?" *pause* " and this place...", sounds like she realized "me"was a little too intimate and she quickly added the rest.
so maybe she has a little crush or maybe saul and victor are more than just tennants... But she doesn't react the same way when victor says hell go too which leads me to believe that one way or another, saul is special to her...to

[abayarts]

That was a frustrating Episode. Nothing Happened. Least we know CJ is upset with Saul. Phone is nogo. But they have a lead that Fort Irwin is Operational.
But not much meat in this episode for me. But the old guy seems to know something about the numbers. Maybe he will remember..

Yea, Glen kept on getting interrupted by people.

[Soundwave]

CJ was obviously upset about finding out that Lizzie was possibly pregnant with Saul's kid. She assumes that the mission the colony is suicide and tries shelter herself from the possible outcome by reducing the two (Saul and victor) to "tenants".

[Privateer]

And now Saul knows! At least that Irwin is operational, and operational in good enough form to throw communications assets and helicopters places. While it should give him comfort to know that the place all his buddies were going to is at least safe, doesn't mean he'll automatically assume it has anything to do with them. I agree, nit a whole lit of meet this ep, but it does establish what a lot of the characters are thinking, not to mention the Saul/CJ drama! *checks his watch* Now time needs to go faster.

[nikvoodoo]

I was listening in a loud place....so I heard "A phone!" but I missed that it was apparently broken. Can't wait to relisten later on.

I'm glad someone finally got through Saul's thick friggin' skull that he can't just run off to do shit. If Ra1th had his way, I'm sure he would have preferred if CJ had not be able to do that. I'm sure he'd prefer Saul run off to his death.

Part of me was sad that Pete mad it to the hummer....it would have been a "Serves you right for being a douche" but I was glad to get the opportunity to undetstand his quip last episode about Saul's scar not being so bad.

As a PS to this post since no one has posted since I finished this: Anyone else notice how much deeper throated "Roman" sounded from part 2 to 3? If the Little Ones don't become the Behemoths....I'mma sit under a high way overpass in Miami waiting to get my face chewed off.

[Soundwave]

Part of me was sad that Pete mad it to the hummer....it would have been a "Serves you right for being a douche" but I was glad to get the opportunity to undetstand his quip last episode about Saul's scar not being so bad.



I don't understand why everyone has a issue with Pete. Yeah, he's kind of a dick. The worst thing he said was the comment about Saul's scar, which was clearly rationalized this episode. Pete was screwed by victor, micheal, the whole lot! They had a good thing (relatively) going at the colony. Not only did he lose all that, but now he's marked for life. That's not something that people are going to brush off.

[Privateer]

I was listening in a loud place....so I heard "A phone!" but I missed that it was apparently broken. Can't wait to relisten later on.

I'm glad someone finally got through Saul's thick friggin' skull that he can't just run off to do shit. If Ra1th had his way, I'm sure he would have preferred if CJ had not be able to do that. I'm sure he'd prefer Saul run off to his death.

Part of me was sad that Pete mad it to the hummer....it would have been a "Serves you right for being a douche" but I was glad to get the opportunity to undetstand his quip last episode about Saul's scar not being so bad.

As a PS to this post since no one has posted since I finished this: Anyone else notice how much deeper throated "Roman" sounded from part 2 to 3? If the Little Ones don't become the Behemoths....I'mma sit under a high way overpass in Miami waiting to get my face chewed off.

Now that you mention it, it may quite have. Gonna have to listen to it again. A question, regarding that, is, well, were there any big ones with numbers on them?

[awkwardalex]

LOL @ 10:05... "Porno"


I did not catch that at first!

[nikvoodoo]

I don't understand why everyone has a issue with Pete. Yeah, he's kind of a dick. The worst thing he said was the comment about Saul's scar, which was clearly rationalized this episode. Pete was screwed by victor, micheal, the whole lot! They had a good thing (relatively) going at the colony. Not only did he lose all that, but now he's marked for life. That's not something that people are going to brush off.

I'm doing it more in reaction/to get a reaction out of the Greg Miller fan boys! ;)

Trolololololololol.

However, since he brought up the whole Lizzy thing he's been pretty agreeable. I just still don't think things are going to end well for him.

[awkwardalex]

I don't understand why everyone has a issue with Pete. Yeah, he's kind of a dick. The worst thing he said was the comment about Saul's scar, which was clearly rationalized this episode. Pete was screwed by victor, micheal, the whole lot! They had a good thing (relatively) going at the colony. Not only did he lose all that, but now he's marked for life. That's not something that people are going to brush off.

First, WELCOME!

Second, we give Pete a hard time because he is played by Greg Miller (playstation, IGN) who recuited many to this podcast, and was a host on We're Not Dead the official community podcast for We're Alive. We like to give him a hard time, teasingly.

[nikvoodoo]

First, WELCOME!

Second, we give Pete a hard time because he is played by Greg Miller (playstation, IGN) who recuited many to this podcast, and was a host on We're Not Dead the official community podcast for We're Alive. We like to give him a hard time, teasingly.

You said it far more gracefully than I did.

[Soundwave]

Ah, I see now, it's similar to the slutty nurse comments from previous episodes. I just started listening to WND a couple weeks ago. It's very well done and I'm glad I found it. Keep up the good work!

[nikvoodoo]

Ah, I see now, it's similar to the slutty nurse comments from previous episodes. I just started listening to WND a couple weeks ago. It's very well done and I'm glad I found it. Keep up the good work!

Exactly. :)

We roast the ones we love.

[wh33t]

This if the first "meat"-less episode that I've really enjoyed. I still enjoyed it much less than the action filled episodes, but you can't always have action.

First off, I love Victor. Him and Saul are so bromantic. I can't think of too many other films where two dudes have such an enjoyable hetero friendship, maybe the Boondock Saints comes close though. Obviously CJ is in a tight spot. Her training keeps her alive, but we all know that there is more to being human than just eating, sleeping and staying out of harms way. Love always finds a way. It's clear that she has some feelings for at least Saul, but maybe there is soft spot in her heart for Victor too, but maybe it's more brotherly. Honestly, knowing what we know about KC I'm not sure at all what is going to happen with these love triangle. KC is the kind of guy to just kill off Lizzy in after the baby is born and then Saul and CJ become a major ass kicking item... Or maybe KC kills off CJ? KC, damn you, you reckless bastard.

I'm stoked that Pete and Glenn are gonna survive. I don't personally sense any double-crossing from these two, but once again ya never know. The Mallers can be very persuasive and they seriously injured Pippen to aid in his disguise. Not only that, but Scratch is a lunatic and Durai is a cold hearted strategist. I think Glenn has something important to contribute to the crew if they'd just let him speak.

As for the little ones, did I understand correctly that they "came back to life"? Wasn't Roman bit or killed, then turned into a little one, attacked them at the door, and then killed and then shot in the head (killed presumably) in the morning?

[ZomNom]

Check it:

I'm laying out some banner-ups for a military tech firm and was searching for images on stock photog sites and came across this:
Check the Patch! (http://www.corbisimages.com/stock-photo/rights-managed/0000326957-014/the-us-army-of-the-future-at?popup=1)

What a coincident. The name of the image is "THE US ARMY OF THE 'FUTURE' AT FORT IRWIN".

[nikvoodoo]

As for the little ones, did I understand correctly that they "came back to life"? Wasn't Roman bit or killed, then turned into a little one, attacked them at the door, and then killed and then shot in the head (killed presumably) in the morning?

The Little One at the door was shot. It was never indicated where it was shot.

So Roman was turned by a "little one" became a "little one", was shot in the chest (or somewhere to make him/it rethink his tactics). Then in the morning he was on the receiving end of two to the chest, and a final one to the head.

[awkwardalex]

Ah, I see now, it's similar to the slutty nurse comments from previous episodes. I just started listening to WND a couple weeks ago. It's very well done and I'm glad I found it. Keep up the good work!

Yup I didn't get the pointing out at first either (I just came in at Thanksgiving -late november- 2011)

And on that note incase anyone missed:
Kc will be on Up at Noon with Greg Miller! Filming on July 18 (I think thats right) airing the following Monday!
Want to be in that audience?
Go.ign.com/upatnoon

[Adventureless_Hero]

It is interesting to see how cold CJ can pretend to be. I'm sure in some instances she really is the cold-hearted witch Saul called her, but in this case, I think she is actually starting to care about Saul to the point that it bothers her. She tries to hide her interest in him behind logic and cold hard facts, but you can still sense it.

I am such a huge fan of Saul! When he showed how he could not be talked out of the hope that Lizzy is alive and can be rescued, I was right there in his corner. I'm a warrior for love and done some pretty herculean shit to fight to keep love, so when I hear Saul ready to bull on and fight to be with the girl he loves, I get riled up. Sure, he doesn't have a damn plan, but it's the idea that he is willing to do anything to get her back that I love to hear. Kudos my friend.

So it has been pretty much confirmed that the former little ones can pass on their infection/traits. I don't necessarily agree that they become behemoths. The idea I am forming has the little ones being a later model of series of attempts to create a super-zombie. We saw zombies that could run fast, jump far, behemoths with thick hides; and now the former little ones are here. They have tattoos to number them, almost as if they are the final product, and have some of the traits of the previous versions of zombies. They have thick hides, amazing strength. I don't know how fast they run though. They seem to be really tall, like Ink was described as being. Maybe they are clones of Pinstripes that have the ability to pass on their version of the infection?

Anywho, I'm hoping that Saul now tries to contact Ft. Irwin in the hopes that with some military back-up, they can free everyone at the colony who isn't in league with the Mallers. (I hope Scratch takes a sniper round to the head at the hands of Riley firing from a helicopter)

[wh33t]

(I hope Scratch takes a sniper round to the head at the hands of Riley firing from a helicopter)

It would be better as an arrow to the throat or something.

Has anyone considered the fact that Pete and Glenn might have been "released" from the colony? It suddenly occurred to me that Glenn or Pete might have some kind of tracking device on them? I think Scratch/Durai might have concluded that Saul maybe survived the final tower assault. When Durai takes over the colony I'm assuming he would have interrogated gatekeeper and perhaps found out about Victor and Michael leaving. He might have also learned of Glenn and Victor's friendship and let them go up north to try and find Victor. Not "let them go" but made it easier for them to escape. It wouldn't be the first time we've witnessed Durais uncanny ability to plan and predict. I'm starting to think Durai isn't just a bad ass criminal syndicate kingpin, maybe he's also got some legit military training to?

But I'm not sure what tracking device they could put on Glenn or Pete with out them knowing that would have a battery that would function that long. But it was just a thought. If you could somehow track their positions and movement you could tell when they were safe because they would roam around the same area for extended periods of time, which they are about to do now that they are in safe house.

[awkwardalex]

It would be better as an arrow to the throat or something.

Has anyone considered the fact that Pete and Glenn might have been "released" from the colony? It suddenly occurred to me that Glenn or Pete might have some kind of tracking device on them? I think Scratch/Durai might have concluded that Saul maybe survived the final tower assault. When Durai takes over the colony I'm assuming he would have interrogated gatekeeper and perhaps found out about Victor and Michael leaving. He might have also learned of Glenn and Victor's friendship and let them go up north to try and find Victor. Not "let them go" but made it easier for them to escape. It wouldn't be the first time we've witnessed Durais uncanny ability to plan and predict. I'm starting to think Durai isn't just a bad ass criminal syndicate kingpin, maybe he's also got some legit military training to?

But I'm not sure what tracking device they could put on Glenn or Pete with out them knowing that would have a battery that would function that long. But it was just a thought. If you could somehow track their positions and movement you could tell when they were safe because they would roam around the same area for extended periods of time, which they are about to do now that they are in safe house.

Thats some smart thinking!

It would really depend what resources colleny mallers have. But I could see scratch planting something. If she kicked them out I would not think she would tell them, because they could relay that information which would peak CJ (or Michael's interest as to why.

[Leedo2502]

Check it:

I'm laying out some banner-ups for a military tech firm and was searching for images on stock photog sites and came across this:
Check the Patch! (http://www.corbisimages.com/stock-photo/rights-managed/0000326957-014/the-us-army-of-the-future-at?popup=1)

What a coincident. The name of the image is "THE US ARMY OF THE 'FUTURE' AT FORT IRWIN".

That's actually the 4th ID patch (4th Infantry Div.) They are at Ft Hood TX. The "arrows" here are actually ivy, we are pretty clever in the Army and call the 4th ID the "Ivy Div"... get it IV the roman numeral for "4"... we are nothing if not punny.

The patch they have at Irwin is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Irwin_National_Training_Center with the arrows pointing inward.

[Kram]

It was fun to hear Glenn going on and on about the number tattoos -- we haven't heard a character speculating/theorizing like that for a while. He sounded like one of us, on the forum.

Like wh33t, I was really glad to hear how supportive Victor was of Saul. Their relationship has improved a lot during the time-jump -- remember how they almost went their separate ways at the beginning of this season? It's nice to hear some characters being on the same page for once.

[nikvoodoo]

Thought regarding the patch: Wouldn't Saul have seen that before? Wasn't he stationed there at some point for training?

[HardKor]

Thought regarding the patch: Wouldn't Saul have seen that before? Wasn't he stationed there at some point for training?

He did recognize the patch, that's why he was so interested in it. He just couldn't remember where he'd seen it before.

[HorrorHiro]

Almost a filler episode, still enjoyed though. I'm really wondering if Kimmet would send death squads and kill teams to the Colony, my guess is no. I could see him keeping an eye on the Colony, but seeing as it is in noway shape or form something to risk the lives of his men for I couldn't see him doing much else. I could see Kimmet wanting to talk to Durai and try to evacuate the entire Colony (including the Mallers) using the logic that the human race is an endangered species.

[Z Sniper]

Meatless?!!! Come on people,....Kc just handed you a brontosaurus burger with a side of whale slaw!! All shoot 'em up, all the time gets old. My advice,...learn to appreciate the nuance. I'm sure you like (or hate) a lot of the characters for the simple reason that you've gotten to know them through the "slower" parts of the episodes. This episode gives you a heck of a lot if you read between the lines. First, Saul, CJ, and Victor have been shackled up for 3 months or so. Saul has now officially spent more time with these two than anybody else from the original crew, meaning, bonds have been created. A lot REALLY did go down this episode as some have you have noted. Not that I'm bias because I AM, but I liked where Kc took this one. Plus, there's a lot to figure out about these damn "little ones", and it's nice to gave Glenn and Pinche Pete back! Well, there you have it,...will you like some fries with that?

[Cabbage Patch]

Meatless?!!! Come on people,....Kc just handed you a brontosaurus burger with a side of whale slaw!! All shoot 'em up, all the time gets old. My advice,...learn to appreciate the nuance. I'm sure you like (or hate) a lot of the characters for the simple reason that you've gotten to know them through the "slower" parts of the episodes. This episode gives you a heck of a lot if you read between the lines. First, Saul, CJ, and Victor have been shackled up for 3 months or so. Saul has now officially spent more time with these two than anybody else from the original crew, meaning, bonds have been created. A lot REALLY did go down this episode as some have you have noted. Not that I'm bias because I AM, but I liked where Kc took this one. Plus, there's a lot to figure out about these damn "little ones", and it's nice to gave Glenn and Pinche Pete back! Well, there you have it,...will you like some fries with that?

It has been fun seeing the growth in the Victor/Saul relationship. You guys have come a long way since all the bickering in Chapters 24 and 25. And Victor is either the best friend in the history of time, or else he's got a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome.

[awkwardalex]

Meatless?!!! Come on people,....Kc just handed you a brontosaurus burger with a side of whale slaw!! All shoot 'em up, all the time gets old. My advice,...learn to appreciate the nuance. I'm sure you like (or hate) a lot of the characters for the simple reason that you've gotten to know them through the "slower" parts of the episodes. This episode gives you a heck of a lot if you read between the lines. First, Saul, CJ, and Victor have been shackled up for 3 months or so. Saul has now officially spent more time with these two than anybody else from the original crew, meaning, bonds have been created. A lot REALLY did go down this episode as some have you have noted. Not that I'm bias because I AM, but I liked where Kc took this one. Plus, there's a lot to figure out about these damn "little ones", and it's nice to gave Glenn and Pinche Pete back! Well, there you have it,...will you like some fries with that?

I did like this episode! It was the first time in a while I didn't fear that you were going to die!

[Z Sniper]

I did like this episode! It was the first time in a while I didn't fear that you were going to die!

Ha! Thanks kiddo!

[Z Sniper]

It has been fun seeing the growth in the Victor/Saul relationship. You guys have come a long way since all the bickering in Chapters 24 and 25. And Victor is either the best friend in the history of time, or else he's got a severe case of Stockholm Syndrome.

Thanks Cabbage Patch! I agree with you,...sometimes we just gotta let things happen, sit awhile, and then,...BAM, IN YO FACE!! Just like poor Angel.

[Cabbage Patch]

Thought regarding the patch: Wouldn't Saul have seen that before? Wasn't he stationed there at some point for training?

Saul would have been at the National Training Center as part of a training unit. That means he would have spent all of his time in the Dust Bowl (a large, dirt floored staging area) and out in the Box. The only place he would have seen the unit patch is on the uniforms of the Observer-Controllers while in the Box, and they rarely have any contact with troops down at the Specialist level. So it's something he would have seen in passing and at a distance. And it's not a particularly memorable patch so there's no reason for it to register strongly.

NTC Shoulder Patch (subdued, which is what Saul and Victor probably have)

http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1981&d=1340065299

NTC Shoulder Patch (color, where you can see the arrows)

http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1980&d=1340065298

NTC Base Insignia (which is what Saul and co would have seen around the base)

http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=1833&d=1336112937

[nikvoodoo]

Meatless?!!! Come on people,....Kc just handed you a brontosaurus burger with a side of whale slaw!! All shoot 'em up, all the time gets old. My advice,...learn to appreciate the nuance. I'm sure you like (or hate) a lot of the characters for the simple reason that you've gotten to know them through the "slower" parts of the episodes. This episode gives you a heck of a lot if you read between the lines. First, Saul, CJ, and Victor have been shackled up for 3 months or so. Saul has now officially spent more time with these two than anybody else from the original crew, meaning, bonds have been created. A lot REALLY did go down this episode as some have you have noted. Not that I'm bias because I AM, but I liked where Kc took this one. Plus, there's a lot to figure out about these damn "little ones", and it's nice to gave Glenn and Pinche Pete back! Well, there you have it,...will you like some fries with that?

A major thank you to Otto. I've been pondering all day if I wanted to start a thread similar to the "Save the Podcast" thread for WND because of the two individuals on facebook who have been complaining for the past month or so and have people sound off. But I think this just about covered everything that needed to be said.

Thanks for the explanation about the Patches, CP and the "derp duh" logic Hardkor. It just struck me as odd that someone that would know enough to suggest Irwin for the MREs back in the day wouldn't be able to identify a patch that originated from there.

Onto bigger and better things: Glenn is the new Datu. I bet the thing he was going to say before he was given the Michael Cold Shoulder Treatment from Cj was he could fix the phone. If Datu can fix a shot to shit helicopter, it stands to reason that Glenn can make a sat phone that's broken in half work.

Prince Glenn the Handy. That is all!

[Hellbringer]

That's actually the 4th ID patch (4th Infantry Div.) They are at Ft Hood TX. The "arrows" here are actually ivy, we are pretty clever in the Army and call the 4th ID the "Ivy Div"... get it IV the roman numeral for "4"... we are nothing if not punny.

The patch they have at Irwin is here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Irwin_National_Training_Center with the arrows pointing inward.


Ha! You say "IVY" and my friends say "Four Lieutenants Pointing North." Wait, by that logic, Victor could be one of them with his recalling of the "Never Eat Shredded -- (Wheat)" comment.

[Hellbringer]

Meatless?!!!

I'm an omnivore myself. I wouldn't say "meatless," but I would say that some of the more flavorful bits have been left on the bone because we can "chew the fat" on the issue. I like plot development, like you pointed out.

[Cabbage Patch]

Glenn is the new Datu. I bet the thing he was going to say before he was given the Michael Cold Shoulder Treatment from Cj was he could fix the phone. If Datu can fix a shot to shit helicopter, it stands to reason that Glenn can make a sat phone that's broken in half work.

Prince Glenn the Handy. That is all!

I was thinking that Glenn was the new Tanya, always getting shut down just on the verge of saying something important. But I like your explanation better. I was so disappointed when Saul found the phone and immediately dismissed it because it was broken; I couldn't believe that the whole Sat Phone story was an elaborate red herring. If Glenn can fix it he will be my new hero.

[Leedo2502]

Ha! You say "IVY" and my friends say "Four Lieutenants Pointing North." Wait, by that logic, Victor could be one of them with his recalling of the "Never Eat Shredded -- (Wheat)" comment.

LMAO... I just figured the whole "four LT's pointing North" would have been lost on the largely civilian crowd here, or get a whole Angel discusion brewing again LOL (sorry Ra1th).

And to nikvoodo; I deployed with the 4th ID and still had to think on it when the other guy posted what he thought the patch was.

[Merlin1274]

Its not meatless. Just was not enough for me to chew on. Not much to speculate in the episode like previous ones. Was really hoping the Sat phone would be in working order.

[wh33t]

Its not meatless. Just was not enough for me to chew on. Not much to speculate in the episode like previous ones. Was really hoping the Sat phone would be in working order.

Glenn's obviously gonna hacks it back together ;)

[ferroaj]

Now that you mention it, it may quite have. Gonna have to listen to it again. A question, regarding that, is, well, were there any big ones with numbers on them?


There probably wouldn't be. If the little ones grow to a behemoth, the number would probably stretch, morph and fade beyond recognition.

[Z Sniper]

I'm an omnivore myself. I wouldn't say "meatless," but I would say that some of the more flavorful bits have been left on the bone because we can "chew the fat" on the issue. I like plot development, like you pointed out.

Yeah,...sorry about those damn typos!

[VEE]

I miss Riley.

[Bullethead]

Am I right in that I heard Glenn say that Roman now had a number on him? What happens you get bit by a little one and a tattoo forms?

Also I forget who beat me to it but I am HIGHLY of the mindset that Glen and Pete are either tracking northern survivors for the Colony or being watched. I mean the only time we can recall the Mallers letting prisoners go is when they have a special task for them (information) or when they were over run by Ink and his crew and just decided to bail.

So how is it that an old man with communications experience (highly vital) and Pete (well he is pete) were able to walk right out from under the mallers grip? And shame on CJ for not thinking of that sooner. As paranoid as she is you'd think that would be priority number 1 especially having heard where they are from and having known what that place was about from Victor.

On a personal note I hope the little ones don't become Bohemeths. I like the idea of multiple variations of zombies out there. I want to see more Jumpers and Fast ones (maybe some we haven't even seen before). Gives us some variety to the run of the mill undead.

[reaper239]

Am I right in that I heard Glenn say that Roman now had a number on him? What happens you get bit by a little one and a tattoo forms?

Also I forget who beat me to it but I am HIGHLY of the mindset that Glen and Pete are either tracking northern survivors for the Colony or being watched. I mean the only time we can recall the Mallers letting prisoners go is when they have a special task for them (information) or when they were over run by Ink and his crew and just decided to bail.

So how is it that an old man with communications experience (highly vital) and Pete (well he is pete) were able to walk right out from under the mallers grip? And shame on CJ for not thinking of that sooner. As paranoid as she is you'd think that would be priority number 1 especially having heard where they are from and having known what that place was about from Victor.

On a personal note I hope the little ones don't become Bohemeths. I like the idea of multiple variations of zombies out there. I want to see more Jumpers and Fast ones (maybe some we haven't even seen before). Gives us some variety to the run of the mill undead.

they didn't just walk right out, i believe glenn said they spent months planning their escape.

also, i don't think little ones become behemoths because we've had behemoths from almost day one and the little ones just showed up a few months ago.

[7oddisdead]

Am I right in that I heard Glenn say that Roman now had a number on him? What happens you get bit by a little one and a tattoo forms?

Also I forget who beat me to it but I am HIGHLY of the mindset that Glen and Pete are either tracking northern survivors for the Colony or being watched. I mean the only time we can recall the Mallers letting prisoners go is when they have a special task for them (information) or when they were over run by Ink and his crew and just decided to bail.

So how is it that an old man with communications experience (highly vital) and Pete (well he is pete) were able to walk right out from under the mallers grip? And shame on CJ for not thinking of that sooner. As paranoid as she is you'd think that would be priority number 1 especially having heard where they are from and having known what that place was about from Victor.

On a personal note I hope the little ones don't become Bohemeths. I like the idea of multiple variations of zombies out there. I want to see more Jumpers and Fast ones (maybe some we haven't even seen before). Gives us some variety to the run of the mill undead.

a few have mentioned in a couple different places about how could pete and glenn, seemingly two important people job wise leave.
glenn was the communications guy, who among the mallers was their communications guy? tardust. now, how well do you see tardust and glenn getting along? not very.

pete ran a shop...as in trading post...store..so a group of rowdy outlaws come rolling into town..what would you expect to happen at the "shop"?...yea. at the point the mallers took over, the "cushy" jobs became the unnessacary ones.

the thing im dying to know is which of the trio that left the colony came up with the idea to leave first? i want to believe glen/pete are on the up and up...but i could totally see a scenario where pete was 'gotten to" and glenn is an unwitting supporter to aid pete once they left...see above as to why glenn would be expendable in the mallers eyes..the great unknown in this is what if the roman guy was actually the mole?

and now for a lil crackpot action

what if......the Litte ones are born of behmoths? we do have evidence of behemoths in the basement of the hospital. we also have points in which the little ones are around the big ones exclusively. if you trace back all the things we know of the two types and look at it from a parents/children angle it makes sense...even if its crazy talk

[Adventureless_Hero]

Meatless?!!! Come on people,....Kc just handed you a brontosaurus burger with a side of whale slaw!! All shoot 'em up, all the time gets old. My advice,...learn to appreciate the nuance. I'm sure you like (or hate) a lot of the characters for the simple reason that you've gotten to know them through the "slower" parts of the episodes. This episode gives you a heck of a lot if you read between the lines. First, Saul, CJ, and Victor have been shackled up for 3 months or so. Saul has now officially spent more time with these two than anybody else from the original crew, meaning, bonds have been created. A lot REALLY did go down this episode as some have you have noted. Not that I'm bias because I AM, but I liked where Kc took this one. Plus, there's a lot to figure out about these damn "little ones", and it's nice to gave Glenn and Pinche Pete back! Well, there you have it,...will you like some fries with that?

I'm glad you brought up the fact that more than a couple of months have passed since the trio at Dunbar apartments was shacked up. Three months in Z-world is like 3 years. Bonds have been made, which is why I was just as surprised as Saul was when CJ grew a layer of ice over her heart. I can tell she is hiding her true emotions by trying to be as logical as possible. But like Saul said, "She's right." They need a plan. Saul has his heart in the right place. I love nothing more than for the hero to go charging in to the castle to rescue his love, but this isn't a fairy tale. Homeboy would get killed.

I also have to give kudos to Victor. He's really transformed into a loyal buddy. He has never met Lizzy, but he's already willing to go back to the place he barely managed to escape by the skin of his teeth just so he could see his friend reunited with the girl he loves.

I agree that this entire chapter was meaty; it wasn't a BK Steakhouse burger but rather a gourmet steak to be appreciated and savored in slow bites. If you want a heart-stopping, artery clogging burger revisit chapter 24. (Shit, now I'm hungry, lol!)

From here, chapter 31 seems like it could go anywhere. I think we could start off at Ft. Irwin viewing these passed few events from Michaels reports, getting to know what his team was doing in L.A. Or it could pick up in the Colony with Lizzy writing in her diary. Or shit, this seems unlikely, but it could even make a departure and go to Boulder, though I very much doubt it. I feel like the book has closed for those characters for the time being. My hope is, that the story will pick up at the Colony.

[nikvoodoo]

they didn't just walk right out, i believe glenn said they spent months planning their escape.

also, i don't think little ones become behemoths because we've had behemoths from almost day one and the little ones just showed up a few months ago.

I remember a few months ago watching a TED talk from Jack Horner who is America's foremost palentologist. He stepped through a number of species of dinosaur we've assumed were different until he asked the logical question: How come we don't see the children and adolescent versions of these creatures?

The reason being is in some instances like Triceratops and Torosaurs are actually the same animals...just younger. But because Triceratops were discovered first, it was considered it's own creature and this small "puny" Torosaur couldn't possibly be the same thing. But he has taken strides to prove it's the same thing.

I feel like it's the same idea. Just because we hadn't seen the Little Ones first, doesn't mean we have a new species of zombie. Roman is pretty much the missing link to me. If he turned into what was described as a little one (#12 dead in the field) and to me he sounded different than he did the night before, I'd say it's almost a slam dunk that the little ones are adolescent Behemoths.

And for your viewing pleasure here is Jack Horner's Ted Talk:

http://www.ted.com/talks/jack_horner_shape_shifting_dinosaurs.html

[Adventureless_Hero]

I remember a few months ago watching a TED talk from Jack Horner who is America's foremost palentologist. He stepped through a number of species of dinosaur we've assumed were different until he asked the logical question: How come we don't see the children and adolescent versions of these creatures?

The reason being is in some instances like Triceratops and Torosaurs are actually the same animals...just younger. But because Triceratops were discovered first, it was considered it's own creature and this small "puny" Torosaur couldn't possibly be the same thing. But he has taken strides to prove it's the same thing.

I feel like it's the same idea. Just because we hadn't seen the Little Ones first, doesn't mean we have a new species of zombie. Roman is pretty much the missing link to me. If he turned into what was described as a little one (#12 dead in the field) and to me he sounded different than he did the night before, I'd say it's almost a slam dunk that the little ones are adolescent Behemoths.

I can see how that could be in fact taking place in the Z-world. Perhaps Behemoths came to exist from Little Ones who were never witnessed as they grew up. But when I think back to the hospital episode in which Riley and Kalani came across the "devil's workshop", I couldn't help but noticed there appears to be two separate rooms. In one the duo witnessed a chair where various tools lay on a table near by; a tattoo pen, a couple of ink wells, and I believe some shears (presumably for the Little One's Claws).

Then there was a separate room that had a bloody bed (or was it also a chair) in which the door frame to the room had been smashed open as though something big had passed through. That, to me, suggests the Behemoths are created almost instantaneously. But, it's poor evidence. That's just the direction my mind is leaning towards.

I'm still going with the idea that these different zombie incarnations are different steps in a process to create the perfect zombie soldier in Ink's undead army.

[reaper239]

I remember a few months ago watching a TED talk from Jack Horner who is America's foremost palentologist. He stepped through a number of species of dinosaur we've assumed were different until he asked the logical question: How come we don't see the children and adolescent versions of these creatures?

The reason being is in some instances like Triceratops and Torosaurs are actually the same animals...just younger. But because Triceratops were discovered first, it was considered it's own creature and this small "puny" Torosaur couldn't possibly be the same thing. But he has taken strides to prove it's the same thing.

I feel like it's the same idea. Just because we hadn't seen the Little Ones first, doesn't mean we have a new species of zombie. Roman is pretty much the missing link to me. If he turned into what was described as a little one (#12 dead in the field) and to me he sounded different than he did the night before, I'd say it's almost a slam dunk that the little ones are adolescent Behemoths.

well, see i don't think so because look at this: it's been six months since we first saw a little one with a number on it, and after all this time they have only managed to get taller, not bulkier, and not giant sized either. and we first saw the behemoths within the first couple of weeks. plus we've never had a report of a behemoth with a number on it, and i think that would be kind of important, "big ass zombie, big ass number on its wrist, hey, i think that might be important."

[Adventureless_Hero]

well, see i don't think so because look at this: it's been six months since we first saw a little one with a number on it, and after all this time they have only managed to get taller, not bulkier, and not giant sized either. and we first saw the behemoths within the first couple of weeks. plus we've never had a report of a behemoth with a number on it, and i think that would be kind of important, "big ass zombie, big ass number on its wrist, hey, i think that might be important."

I agree. The numbering of the Little Ones should be higher if we've already encountered some Behemoths, no? Plus, Angel and Kalani never mentioned spotting any tattoos on the Behemoths when they looked one over rather well. BUT, in all fairness, tattoos don't stretch well. *insert 60 year-old tramp stamp image here*

[nikvoodoo]

well, see i don't think so because look at this: it's been six months since we first saw a little one with a number on it, and after all this time they have only managed to get taller, not bulkier, and not giant sized either. and we first saw the behemoths within the first couple of weeks. plus we've never had a report of a behemoth with a number on it, and i think that would be kind of important, "big ass zombie, big ass number on its wrist, hey, i think that might be important."

Someone a couple pages back pointed out that the tattoo would have been huge and distended past the point of recognition. Sorta like that joke that when you are young you get a tattoo of Madonna and when you're older it looks like Marvin Hamlish.

The first behemoth we saw was there within 2 months. Not weeks. We first saw a behemoth at the end of June/early July. If the little ones are still being made, the ones we are seeing could be still growing. For all we know behemoths are an accident. If they are being numbered for the purpose of keeping track of versions it could be that Behemoths are the accident, but the 6'7" skinny powerful version might be what was being sought after in the first place.

[Cabbage Patch]

It seems like the specialized zombie types have only shown up around LA. Why so few and so limited a range? Could the Little Ones be part of a captive breeding program? An organized effort to increase behemoth numbers?

[Adventureless_Hero]

For all we know behemoths are an accident. If they are being numbered for the purpose of keeping track of versions it could be that Behemoths are the accident, but the 6'7" skinny powerful version might be what was being sought after in the first place.

Hallelujah! That's exactly what I've been thinking. I am currently nursing the theory that Ink is tinkering with human dna and the virus in his Devil's Workshop. I would venture to say that the Little Ones are his babies; made from his blood and some genetic tampering. That's why he's numbering them. They are versions of him.

[Z Sniper]

I'm glad you brought up the fact that more than a couple of months have passed since the trio at Dunbar apartments was shacked up. Three months in Z-world is like 3 years. Bonds have been made, which is why I was just as surprised as Saul was when CJ grew a layer of ice over her heart. I can tell she is hiding her true emotions by trying to be as logical as possible. But like Saul said, "She's right." They need a plan. Saul has his heart in the right place. I love nothing more than for the hero to go charging in to the castle to rescue his love, but this isn't a fairy tale. Homeboy would get killed.

I also have to give kudos to Victor. He's really transformed into a loyal buddy. He has never met Lizzy, but he's already willing to go back to the place he barely managed to escape by the skin of his teeth just so he could see his friend reunited with the girl he loves.

I agree that this entire chapter was meaty; it wasn't a BK Steakhouse burger but rather a gourmet steak to be appreciated and savored in slow bites. If you want a heart-stopping, artery clogging burger revisit chapter 24. (Shit, now I'm hungry, lol!)

From here, chapter 31 seems like it could go anywhere. I think we could start off at Ft. Irwin viewing these passed few events from Michaels reports, getting to know what his team was doing in L.A. Or it could pick up in the Colony with Lizzy writing in her diary. Or shit, this seems unlikely, but it could even make a departure and go to Boulder, though I very much doubt it. I feel like the book has closed for those characters for the time being. My hope is, that the story will pick up at the Colony.

Hey Adventureless, I gotta agree with you. A lot of little things to savor on this one. I mean, isn't this the first time we see Saul actually admit he's gotta think things over? Has our Saul gone and grown up? *getting all teary eyed*

[Adventureless_Hero]

Hey Adventureless, I gotta agree with you. A lot of little things to savor on this one. I mean, isn't this the first time we see Saul actually admit he's gotta think things over? Has our Saul gone and grown up? *getting all teary eyed*

Nah, he just found out his girl is pregnant and that kinda made him wonder if he's ready to give up his bachelor lifestyle. The dude is in an apartment surrounded by pussy...cats. Get your minds out of the gutter, cabrones!

[reaper239]

Someone a couple pages back pointed out that the tattoo would have been huge and distended past the point of recognition. Sorta like that joke that when you are young you get a tattoo of Madonna and when you're older it looks like Marvin Hamlish.

The first behemoth we saw was there within 2 months. Not weeks. We first saw a behemoth at the end of June/early July. If the little ones are still being made, the ones we are seeing could be still growing. For all we know behemoths are an accident. If they are being numbered for the purpose of keeping track of versions it could be that Behemoths are the accident, but the 6'7" skinny powerful version might be what was being sought after in the first place.

but when we saw the lab at the hospital it was abandoned. if they were still being built, why abandon such a valuable lab site for something that, unless it was previously stocked, probably doesn't have the same medical resources. so, let's say also that they have still been under contruction and that the little ones turn into behemoths: why are they still at 12? if the numbers are there to help keep track of them, why only at 12, shouldn't it be higher? and what about during the ambush in the tankers? lizzy made it sound like there was more than 12, so we should be seeing much higher numbers. and why haven't our heros been seeing more behemoths? i'd imagine that during idle conversation over the last chapter, it would've come up at some point that there has been a surge of behmoths in LA, that just seems like something important that KC would've worked in there.

now, i'm totally willing to concede that the thin mints were the real objective all along, or are a step closer to the real objective, but it doesn't make sense to me, based on the evidence on hand, that thin mints turn into behemoths.

[Bullethead]

I have a hard time wrapping my head around the shear physics of a little one biting a normal human and turning him into a little one.

Lets say Big ol' Burt is bitten. Does he all a sudden loose 50 lbs and grow a foot?

I'm not saying its impossible I mean we are in Zombie world so I suppose anything is possible. I just don't know how a bite, if we were to look at it as an infection of some sort, could cause human bones to grow.

[7oddisdead]

but when we saw the lab at the hospital it was abandoned. if they were still being built, why abandon such a valuable lab site for something that, unless it was previously stocked, probably doesn't have the same medical resources. so, let's say also that they have still been under contruction and that the little ones turn into behemoths: why are they still at 12? if the numbers are there to help keep track of them, why only at 12, shouldn't it be higher? and what about during the ambush in the tankers? lizzy made it sound like there was more than 12, so we should be seeing much higher numbers. and why haven't our heros been seeing more behemoths? i'd imagine that during idle conversation over the last chapter, it would've come up at some point that there has been a surge of behmoths in LA, that just seems like something important that KC would've worked in there.

now, i'm totally willing to concede that the thin mints were the real objective all along, or are a step closer to the real objective, but it doesn't make sense to me, based on the evidence on hand, that thin mints turn into behemoths.

i just went on a massive tirade about this similar thing in the vip box...if little ones become behemoths...why do we have evidence of both of them at the workshop? if they are created at the same place and in a similar window of time....great. but the evidence now does not look that way. i dunno man...its quite the mess when you stop to think about it..kind of a chicken or egg scenario.

look at it this way..say the behemoths are accidents...big ole giants that mutated instantly...little ones grew more in the proper way....slowly. but now we have this roman dude...who by the time this chapter was over sounded more like a behemoth..in the course of what?..a thirty-six hour period?...yea..something does not compute here

[Kc]

I have a hard time wrapping my head around the shear physics of a little one biting a normal human and turning him into a little one.

Lets say Big ol' Burt is bitten. Does he all a sudden loose 50 lbs and grow a foot?

I'm not saying its impossible I mean we are in Zombie world so I suppose anything is possible. I just don't know how a bite, if we were to look at it as an infection of some sort, could cause human bones to grow.

To answer that: It didn't grow overnight- But there were some reputable changes to give off the appearance dissimilar to the normal "biters". Roman didn't go from 5 foot 7 to 6 foot 7, if that makes sense, but it was enough to see a change.

[Adventureless_Hero]

To answer that: It didn't grow overnight- But there were some reputable changes to give off the appearance dissimilar to the normal "biters". Roman didn't go from 5 foot 7 to 6 foot 7, if that makes sense, but it was enough to see a change.

I don't know why, but that made me picture Zombie-Roman running, pausing, putting on high heels, then shambling after the gang.

Anyway, I'm keeping an open mind. If I can picture Bruce Banner hulking out, then I have no problem watching a person turn into some twisted and nightmarish creature that once resembled a man.

[Kc]

I feel like in an answering mood after listening to the complainers on Facebook. I could respond to them directly, but I don't see any benefit to it. They want A->C and don't care about B, even...

[reaper239]

To answer that: It didn't grow overnight- But there were some reputable changes to give off the appearance dissimilar to the normal "biters". Roman didn't go from 5 foot 7 to 6 foot 7, if that makes sense, but it was enough to see a change.

so, in other words, the changes happen slowly, but faster than would normally happen, enough so that it is noticeable that a change is occuring. is that about right?

[reaper239]

zactly, my old man was in the army for 23 years and i remember like, two of his unit patches. and one was first cav, so that's like, obvious. during the time we were at hohenfels in germany (training...

[nikvoodoo]

Like I said earlier, I've been trying to be a good little boy about the facebook comments....but here's the one thing I'll say about that:

How is it that people can simultaneously complain that the story is moving too slow, but is also too fast and jumbled together as in we're rushing to the end?

First of all If the story is too jumbled, you aren't smart enough to follow. And should that person read this line: Good move not responding to my loaded compliment two weeks ago because I was about to destroy you no matter which way you responded.

As for the lady's critique: .....how is this going out with a putt? There are 5 chapters left this season and (in theory) 12 more. THE STORY HAS JUST REACHED THE HALFWAY POINT!!!!

Can we make these people grovel for forgiveness when they want to compliment the production again?

[Kc]

so, in other words, the changes happen slowly, but faster than would normally happen, enough so that it is noticeable that a change is occurring. is that about right?

I'll remain a little vague, but, IF the little ones were say 5 foot when they first saw them... and then 6 foot 7 - 4 months later. That'd be an average growth of .15 Inches a day.
That's not a spoiler or saying anything, just math.

The changes in appearance, pigment and such, were resembling more like the little ones at a faster rate than just a normal "biter". But height difference, if any, would most likely be negligible.


I say this and comment because I don't like the "Alien" or "Prometheus" ideas that creatures can grow mass without ingesting anything, as if physics didn't matter any more. SURE, it's science fiction, but that doesn't mean there's no room for certain parameters of believability.

[Cabbage Patch]

The patch... When you're there for training you are there with your unit, and the trainers sometimes aren't even seen by some of the troops sent there. So even thought Saul went there, it's feasible he wouldn't have seen the patch enough to remember it. And in the military there are so many- you lose track.

I wore the actual patch that was described on my shoulder for an extended period, and despite a clear description I couldn't place it before the big reveal. The subdued version of the NTC patch is really just a black blob on a green background, totally forgettable.

[Kc]

Can we make these people grovel for forgiveness when they want to compliment the production again?

Me thinks there's other issues at play too. Reading other comments the the facebook threads the person in question was intoxicated and upset about something. Some poor audio podcast just might have been an outlet for them.

[reaper239]

I'll remain a little vague, but, IF the little ones were say 5 foot when they first saw them... and then 6 foot 7 - 4 months later. That'd be an average growth of .15 Inches a day.
That's not a spoiler or saying anything, just math.

The changes in appearance, pigment and such, were resembling more like the little ones at a faster rate than just a normal "biter". But height difference, if any, would most likely be negligible.


I say this and comment because I don't like the "Alien" or "Prometheus" ideas that creatures can grow mass without ingesting anything, as if physics didn't matter any more. SURE, it's science fiction, but that doesn't mean there's no room for certain parameters of believability.

o. m. g. he responded TO MY POST!!!!!!!!!!!! i am never washing this thread again.

ok, see i was thinking the little ones were more like 2-3 feet when we first saw them, though regardless, i see your point. so he didn't look too different physically, mostly cosmetically. did he also have a number or was i imagining that?

[Kc]

o. m. g. he responded TO MY POST!!!!!!!!!!!! i am never washing this thread again.

ok, see i was thinking the little ones were more like 2-3 feet when we first saw them, though regardless, i see your point. so he didn't look too different physically, mostly cosmetically. did he also have a number or was i imagining that?

No number was noted.


o. m. g. he responded TO MY POST!!!!!!!!!!!! i am never washing this thread again.

Simpsons modified quote: "I no longer control the thread the thread controls me!!!!"

[Bullethead]

To answer that: It didn't grow overnight- But there were some reputable changes to give off the appearance dissimilar to the normal "biters". Roman didn't go from 5 foot 7 to 6 foot 7, if that makes sense, but it was enough to see a change.

That would explain why both Saul and Glenn felt as though they recognized or had seen Roman before. Ty KC.

Also regarding facebook...Haters gon' hate, just do you

[Adventureless_Hero]

Me thinks there's other issues at play too. Reading other comments the the facebook threads the person in question was intoxicated and upset about something. Some poor audio podcast just might have been an outlet for them.

?! It wasn't ME was it?! I'm totally getting paranoid now as I drink quite a bit. But I can't ever see myself bashing WA. Still... it wasn't me was it?!

edit
Oh thank the goddesses. It wasn't me. I did get drunk this weekend but relegated my drunken posts to Battle Royale (japanese awesomeness) and Gaia.

[socali]

Thanks Cabbage Patch! I agree with you,...sometimes we just gotta let things happen, sit awhile, and then,...BAM, IN YO FACE!! Just like poor Angel.

Agree!

[Kc]

Now, one of the two posting on facebook says they're no longer following us. To that, I said Farewell.

[nikvoodoo]

I'm so going to miss that profane waste of space...oh wait....no I'm not.

[Witch_Doctor]

Now, one of the two posting on facebook says they're no longer following us. To that, I said Farewell.

Don't give them any thought. You can't please everyone. You've created a great story and it wouldn't be so if you let the tail wag the dog. Ever go to a classy restaurant and try a bite of a new dish that had something really good in it? At first, you wish that that ingredient was mixed in throughout the entire dish. However, the chef knows better. The chef knows about build up and anticipation. The chef knows about building a foundation for the pallet. The chef knows how one flavor effect the taste buds when it replaces another flavor. Otherwise, it would be like eating a cheese burger with nothing but cheese. It's like the difference between erotica and porn.

Besides, there were only two grumpy posters out of 19,000 fans. The one leaving doesn't even realize it was you who responded.

[Kc]

Yeah, and they continue on facebook. I have half a mind to just ban em and be done with it. I'm all for constructive criticism, but if someone wants to troll our feed, then it's not worth it.

[wh33t]

Now, one of the two posting on facebook says they're no longer following us. To that, I said Farewell.

Not that I want to derail this thread, but I see it's already kind of happening (feel free to move this post somewhere else if need be) but I have a question for you KC and I'm not sure where exactly to post it. But I would love to know the back story of how We're Alive came to be. What your previous experiences and works in relation to story telling? Do you have some kind of portfolio? What official and non-official training do you have as a director? How do you find your actors? Do the actors get paid? Hrm, maybe I should just PM you.

[Kc]

Not that I want to derail this thread, but I see it's already kind of happening (feel free to move this post somewhere else if need be) but I have a question for you KC and I'm not sure where exactly to post it. But I would love to know the back story of how We're Alive came to be. What your previous experiences and works in relation to story telling? Do you have some kind of portfolio? What official and non-official training do you have as a director? How do you find your actors? Do the actors get paid? Hrm, maybe I should just PM you.

I talk about it a bit in the ask him anything thread in the top news section as most of the answers are in there, and then feel free to add your own.

[Hellbringer]

First of all If the story is too jumbled, you aren't smart enough to follow.


aw, carp... I mean, crap.

[Gadge80]

Hey all,
Noobie here from across the pond in UK, just signed up to the forum today, but have listened to every episode so far and I can't explain how much I am loving this! AMAZING!

Right intro done, can I just skip back to the very beginning of ShortTermMemory (30-1), with Souls diary entry....

It's been a while since his last entry and recently some crazy shit has happened so he is now writing again. He mentions briefly that the drip is done and the antibiotics seemed to have done the trick in getting him up and fully functional again.
We all knew this was always going to be the case ever since we learnt that his mum had been bitten but had not yet turned (she too has obviously "managed" the infection using the same cocktail of antibiotics and that's how she knew what to give to her son)
So now it'll be interesting if Soul and the gang return to "ground zero" and see if Soul still has no reaction... I got a feeling he wont... and I can see a nice little twist emerging here, but maybe I'm looking too much into it....

So now back to We're Not Dead to get my medicated controlled fix before the good stuff is available again... I'm so glad there are 39, 50min podcasts to see me through the dark, cold, lonely nights :)

[VEE]

Hey all

Hey, good, another another one, soon we British shall infect this forum until we take control [evil laughter below]


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRamB30E9mU

[Privateer]

Man, I missed /drama/? On /Facebook/? I actually have a morbid fascination about what went on there. Couldn't find it. Oh well.

Anyway, moving the thread back over, and maybe I'm forgetting something from a previous episode, but is anyone else curious as to how well stocked/developed/prolific CJs safehouses are?

[clem131]

Something that has not been mentioned yet on this episode:
I *capsized* upon hearing Pete say "Sooo... should we leave you two alone or something?". I love Pete.

[reaper239]

Hey, good, another another one, soon we British shall infect this forum until we take control [evil laughter below]


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRamB30E9mU

http://thetarquin.com/Upload/porch.jpg

you bring the infection, i'll bring the cure.

[nikvoodoo]

So now back to We're Not Dead to get my medicated controlled fix before the good stuff is available again... I'm so glad there are 39, 50min podcasts to see me through the dark, cold, lonely nights :)

Problem is...some dude name nikvoodoo talks for about 45 minutes of those 50. That guy totally sucks. :p

[VEE]

Problem is...some dude name nikvoodoo talks for about 45 minutes of those 50. That guy totally sucks. :p

I'm told he also blows.

[reaper239]

I'm told he also blows.

http://www.myfacewhen.net/uploads/56-dayum.jpg

[VEE]

http://i.imgur.com/6N2Fa.gif

[socali]

Now, one of the two posting on facebook says they're no longer following us. To that, I said Farewell.

It's that individual's lost.

[reaper239]

http://i.imgur.com/6N2Fa.gif

y'know, maybe we oughtta take this little show on the road. i know some great forums we could harrass. no, i'm kidding, all my friends are on his forum, and that makes me a sad panda

http://assets.head-fi.org/3/39/39605a5d_sadpanda.gif

[VEE]

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/568872/sad-panda-podiatrist_medium.jpg

[socali]

I'm sure this got brought up somewhere in this thread but it bugs the frak out of me that CJ stopped Glen from talking when he said "I wasn't going to say anything but..." Then CJ comes in and says, "then don't". Freaken aye man! Really KC?!? REALLY?!?!

[Witch_Doctor]

I'm sure this got brought up somewhere in this thread but it bugs the frak out of me that CJ stopped Glen from talking when he said "I wasn't going to say anything but..." Then CJ comes in and says, "then don't". Freaken aye man! Really KC?!? REALLY?!?!

My wife thinks Glenn was going to mention Sean.
Glenn is the new Tanya. Can't get a word in edge-wise.

[Cabbage Patch]

I wonder if Saul and Victor have ever mentioned Sean, Samantha, Hope or Skittles to CJ? I would have thought they would by now, but our heroes can be a little communication-challenged sometimes.

[Bullethead]

im not sure what glenn was about to say, maybe he was just going to tell the block headed Saul that CJ clearly likes him.

but I definately don't see why amongst all that going on he would just randomly say "Hey I knew a guy named Sean once"...seems a little out of place given the conversation brewing about 'we're just tennents'

[Cabbage Patch]

im not sure what glenn was about to say, maybe he was just going to tell the block headed Saul that CJ clearly likes him.

but I definately don't see why amongst all that going on he would just randomly say "Hey I knew a guy named Sean once"...seems a little out of place given the conversation brewing about 'we're just tennents'

I think Nik's idea that Glenn was going to offer to fix the sat phone is more likely.

[VEE]

1985

[Witch_Doctor]

I still smell a rat. Perhaps they were not sent to spy but to lure. They use the encrypted police band radios and Glenn states in Chapter 19/2 11:20 that he has Police Radios. They could have been eaves dropping on them since Saul and Victor moved in with CJ. You might say, "Well, why didn't he hear them talking earlier when Michael asked him if he heard anything when he was at at the Colony?" The most likely reason would be that Dunbar had been overrun before Glenn was rescued by Saul or the Colony didn't have access to a Police Radio yet. This would mean that CJ wouldn't have had anyone to talk to therefore there would not have been any radio chatter coming from L.A. until AFTER Saul and Victor move in with her.
If Saul's voice is recognized and Scratch is still ape-shit over the the Tower folk then why not try to lure someone to the Colony instead of trying to find them in LA? Rough them up a bit, give them a peek at Lizzy. Tell them a few things about who Sean was, where he may have came from. Then let them escape. Also, Hope says that everyone knows how she became blind, so every knows about the Dunbar Tower and everyone knows that Sean was there. Glenn can put peices together easily, he's a smart ol dude.
Plus, It make no sense for Glenn to say, "I wasn't going to say anything but I can fix your Satellite Phone." Why WOULDN'T he say that? If he wants to get the heck out he would have blurted out, "Hey Saul, I can fix that!" Instead, he didn't even hear Saul mention the broken phone because he was gibbering on about Roman turing into a zombie.

[nikvoodoo]

If they are meant to lure and are listening in on police bands, why would Pete bring up the idea of being overheard? That would kinda tip one's hand wouldn't you think?

Besides, if they are trying to lure Saul into the Colony....and they have the radio and by your own scenario it doesn't make sense to seek them out in LA....why didn't they just call over the radio?

And just because he didn't hear Saul say it, you can easily see a phone broken in half. If he's emptying out the bag, he probably would have left the items in it on a table or something out in the open.

[Cabbage Patch]

I still smell a rat. Perhaps they were not sent to spy but to lure. They use the encrypted police band radios and Glenn states in Chapter 19/2 11:20 that he has Police Radios. They could have been eaves dropping on them since Saul and Victor moved in with CJ.

It's possible that the Colony could be eavesdropping on the Other Tower's Police Radios, but it's a long-shot. These radios are short range, and they rely on networks of repeaters tuned to specific frequencies in order to talk over distances. It's unlikely that the signal is reaching the Colony, so they'd need to send someone inside the repeaters' range to hear the signals. Plus they're encrypted, with all the radios coded in a manner that's unique to the network. You can break that encryption, but it takes a high powered computer, very specialized software and someone who knows how to do it. And CJ seems paranoid enough that she'd follow SOP and change the encryption key on a regular basis.


If Saul's voice is recognized and Scratch is still ape-shit over the the Tower folk then why not try to lure someone to the Colony instead of trying to find them in LA? Rough them up a bit, give them a peek at Lizzy. Tell them a few things about who Sean was, where he may have came from. Then let them escape.

That makes sense. Plus it's likely that Scratch would assume that Saul was with Michael and the other survivors (including Pegs).


Plus, It make no sense for Glenn to say, "I wasn't going to say anything but I can fix your Satellite Phone." Why WOULDN'T he say that? If he wants to get the heck out he would have blurted out, "Hey Saul, I can fix that!" Instead, he didn't even hear Saul mention the broken phone because he was gibbering on about Roman turing into a zombie.

We don't know that Glenn missed the Sat Phone. Yes, he was busy talking at the time that Saul found it, but the volume of Saul's voice went up noticeably when he found it and we don't know which way Glenn was looking at the time, he could have seen the phone and realized it was something he could fix. Near the end of the scene he also comments "is that the rest of the soldier's stuff", which indicates that he looked at the stuff Saul pulled from his bag. Besides, why would the Sat Phone have been brought into the story, and left for the survivors to find if it's just going to be thrown away with no payoff?

[Witch_Doctor]

We were meant to hear Saul mention the phone. Also, even if the phones are encrypted, they can tell that there is some sort of radio chatter. The Dunbars even have a network.


Besides, if they are trying to lure Saul into the Colony....and they have the radio and by your own scenario it doesn't make sense to seek them out in LA....why didn't they just call over the radio?


If the radios are encrypted then they would not have been able to just call them up.


If they are meant to lure and are listening in on police bands, why would Pete bring up the idea of being overheard? That would kinda tip one's hand wouldn't you think?

Glenn assuages any concern about that by saying that they are encrypted. Besides, Pete is clueless. He's doesn't know what's going on at all. I think they all are, but Pete is the most clueless. He has no idea that he's been sent by the Mallers to do their secret bidding. Example: When Saul is trying to convince CJ that Lizzy is still alive he says Pete mentions Lizzy by name. Pete, trying to be as accurately helpful as possible says, "Well, actually I said Libby, but Lizzy sounds about right." Pete believes his own story because he's is telling the truth about what he knows. He didn't even want to let Saul and Victor into the school. Besides, there is no need for the Mallers to clue in Glenn and Pete on what their mission is. In fact, they might not even know that they are on a mission. They think they escaped, fair and square. They were probably allowed to escape like Luke, Han and Leia did from the Death Star. Also, who in their right mind would send Glenn all alone into deep doodoo voodoo zombieland. He sounds old enough to have overheard the Titanic's distress call first hand. Let him escape with a couple of others for his own protection. Pete must have really wanted to get out of there. His back has been beaten more severely than Glenn's arm.


Plus, It makes no sense for Glenn to say, "I wasn't going to say anything but I can fix your Satellite Phone." Why WOULDN'T he say that? If he wants to get the heck out he would have blurted out, "Hey Saul, I can fix that!" Instead, he didn't even hear Saul mention the broken phone because he was gibbering on about Roman turning into a zombie.

We don't know that Glenn missed the Sat Phone. Yes, he was busy talking at the time that Saul found it, but the volume of Saul's voice went up noticeably when he found it and we don't know which way Glenn was looking at the time, he could have seen the phone and realized it was something he could fix. Besides, why would the Sat Phone have been brought into the story, and left for the survivors to find if it's just going to be thrown away with no payoff?

Yes, Glenn could have seen the phone clearly, but it still makes little sense for him to keep to himself his ability to repair the sat phone. If Glenn was thinking to himself, " Ooo, a Sat Phone. I can fix that baby like brand new. Better keep that to myself. I don't trust these guys, yet." Then it wouldn't make sense to say effectively, "I can fix that Sat Phone. I wasn't going to tell you guys that I could do it but then I changed my mind." CJ is already paranoid, that wouldn't help them one bit.

[nikvoodoo]

Maybe its because I have tired new dad brain, but I'm not following your logic at all.

The police radios are encrypted. Therefore, they can't be listening in on Saul, Cj and Victor's conversations. But in your original post you said the Mallers could be ever since Saul and Victor moved into Dunbar. Which one is it because it can't be both.

[wh33t]

Maybe its because I have tired new dad brain, but I'm not following your logic at all.

The police radios are encrypted. Therefore, they can't be listening in on Saul, Cj and Victor's conversations. But in your original post you said the Mallers could be ever since Saul and Victor moved into Dunbar. Which one is it because it can't be both.

I believe CJ is changing the encryption codes every time they go out on an errand. I doubt the Mallers or the Colony have/had any electronics experts that could break the encryption. I think I remember Victor mentioning that CJ had changed the codes at one point. I may have to re-listen.

[nikvoodoo]

I believe CJ is changing the encryption codes every time they go out on an errand. I doubt the Mallers or the Colony have/had any electronics experts that could break the encryption. I think I remember Victor mentioning that CJ had changed the codes at one point. I may have to re-listen.

Well that's my point. If the encryption changes (or even if it stays the same) you can't be listening in to Dunbar conversations at the Colony.

But that was the reason Witch_Doctor said they were sending people out in the first place to find Saul and Victor.


They use the encrypted police band radios and Glenn states in Chapter 19/2 11:20 that he has Police Radios. They could have been eaves dropping on them since Saul and Victor moved in with CJ.

That's what I'm getting confused by. The colony would have to crack the encryption in order to be able to listen in, if they'd done that, they could call up and have the hook baited to get Saul and another live one to tell Scratch where the Tower survivors went.

[wh33t]

Well that's my point. If the encryption changes (or even if it stays the same) you can't be listening in to Dunbar conversations at the Colony.

But that was the reason Witch_Doctor said they were sending people out in the first place to find Saul and Victor.



That's what I'm getting confused by. The colony would have to crack the encryption in order to be able to listen in, if they'd done that, they could call up and have the hook baited to get Saul and another live one to tell Scratch where the Tower survivors went.

I should have clarified, I'm supporting your arguments ;)

[Adventureless_Hero]

For my own sake, I am going to completely drop the notion that Glenn and Pete are moles or spies. Pete would have to be one hell of a well trained spy to use reverse psychology so well. Recall that he didn't want anything to do with Saul and Victor. If he were a spy, he would have done his best to be likeable and trust worthy to be privy to any and all information available.
Then there is Glenn. He had no reason to be pissed at Victor, right out. At first he was probably one of the only people living at the colony that knew in his aged heart of hearts that Victor would never try to betray the colony. So when Gatekeeper told the colony folk that Victor and the new arrivals had tried to sabotage the colony, Glen was probably one of the only one's to say, "Now just hold on a second there, fella. I don't think Victor would do such a thing. That nice young man saved my life once."
It wasn't until Glen met up with Victor and Saul did he learn that Victor had intentionally taken all the guns and ammo with him, thereby leaving the colony folk in a lurch.

BUT...there is possibility that Glen and Pete are carrying a tracking device of some sort and don't know it. The Mallers may have been brilliant enough to let Roman, Glen, and Pete think they were escaping when in reality the Mallers just said, let them go, we'll track them later. Although I think it's an unlikely scenario, I do believe it is more probable than Glen and/or Pete being outright spies for the Mallers.

My favorite theory: Glen, Roman, and Pete miraculously escaped from the colony. Roman got turned. Saul and Victor stumble upon Glen and Pete. It's as simple as has been explained to us. :D

[nikvoodoo]

I should have clarified, I'm supporting your arguments ;)

I told you I was tired.......*zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz*

[wh33t]

My favorite theory: Glen, Roman, and Pete miraculously escaped from the colony. Roman got turned. Saul and Victor stumble upon Glen and Pete. It's as simple as has been explained to us. :D

Well that's no fun! I'm with you though. I just thought Glenn and Pete escaping on their own merits seemed a bit unlikely, but perhaps now that the Mallers have inherited plenty of slaves and a pre-built compound perhaps they are more slack watching over their slaves.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Well that's no fun! I'm with you though. I just thought Glenn and Pete escaping on their own merits seemed a bit unlikely, but perhaps now that the Mallers have inherited plenty of slaves and a pre-built compound perhaps they are more slack watching over their slaves.

I was thinking that this could also be a subtle hint from the author that the Colony isn't so locked down as it used to be. Perhaps since the Maller take-over, not only have living conditions taken a nose dive, but security is falling apart too. Maybe Ft. Irwin won't need to attack the colony. There is always the chance that the biters could over run that place.

[wh33t]

I was thinking that this could also be a subtle hint from the author that the Colony isn't so locked down as it used to be. Perhaps since the Maller take-over, not only have living conditions taken a nose dive, but security is falling apart too. Maybe Ft. Irwin won't need to attack the colony. There is always the chance that the biters could over run that place.

Nice, totally valid imo.

[Cabbage Patch]

My favorite theory: Glen, Roman, and Pete miraculously escaped from the colony. Roman got turned. Saul and Victor stumble upon Glen and Pete. It's as simple as has been explained to us. :D

I agree with you on this. I think Glen, Roman and Pete ran away and got lucky in meeting Saul and Victor, with no ulterior motives.

But, just for the sake of argument, there is the possiblity that one or more of the escapees could be a spy, with the Mallers holding hostages to guarantee that they report back. Scratch has done this before. Maybe Glen has a girlfriend. Or Scratch could be holding Pete's beloved water bottles.

[wh33t]

I agree with you on this. I think Glen, Roman and Pete ran away and got lucky in meeting Saul and Victor, with no ulterior motives.

But, just for the sake of argument, there is the possiblity that one or more of the escapees could be a spy, with the Mallers holding hostages to guarantee that they report back. Scratch has done this before. Maybe Glen has a girlfriend. Or Scratch could be holding Pete's beloved water bottles.

Now that you mention it... Doesn't anyone think it's a little strange that Pete maintained his store? Pete mentions that Lizzy came into his "store"... What the hell would he be doing running a store when the Mallers have shown up and turned everyone into slaves?

[Adventureless_Hero]

Now that you mention it... Doesn't anyone think it's a little strange that Pete maintained his store? Pete mentions that Lizzy came into his "store"... What the hell would he be doing running a store when the Mallers have shown up and turned everyone into slaves?

They probably didn't want to disrupt the flow too much. They just wanted to take over and enjoy the "cushy" lifestyle. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
They likely left Glen working at the communications station, but put Tardust as his boss. I can see anyone who didn't shut up and do as they were told became a slave or dead. The slaves that were already slaves, just had a new safe haven to work as slaves. I bet there were even folks, like some of the guardians, who were happy the mallers arrived. Some guys, like Thumpkin, seemed off kilter and probably wanted to act a bit crazier than management at the Colony allowed.

[MenashaCorpse]

Glenn assuages any concern about that by saying that they are encrypted.

Assuages? Nice vocab. No sarcasm!! Seriously!! (My mom was an english teacher)

Also - Luke, Han and Leia? Nice.

[AMcJV12]

You know, as much as I hate to admit it, CJ does make some valid points when she bitches out Saul. It's not exactly going to be a cakewalk to rescue Lizzy, and Saul has proven in the past that he isn't the best at thinking clearly when it comes to planning ahead. It's also true that him going puts everyone at Dunbar at risk; if the Mallers catch him, they would have no qualms about torturing him to find out where he came from. Sure, CJ could help with the planning, but from her perspective, why should she? Putting everyone at risk for just one woman (no matter how much Saul may love her) just doesn't make sense. Will Saul go anyway? Yep. Will CJ help him? Probably. Is it the right thing to do? Not necessarily.

[Witch_Doctor]

Hope this clears up a bit of confusion. There were two posts, each dealing with different scenarios.
Fact: After Victor and Saul move in with CJ, they begin to use the Police radios that were in place prior to Dunbar falling to Mr Pinstripe Suit.

Scenario #1
Low probability.
The Mallers are able to listen to unencrypted radio communication OR they can decode the encrypted communication.
If this is the case then someone could recognize Saul's voice.
Ape-shit Scratch sees an opportunity to continue her quest to find what ever the hell she's wants from the Tower guys.
Allows some guys to 'escape' who are likely going to look for Michael, Pegs and some other chick.
Why not just call them up and say, "Hey, we have Lizzy!"? I don't freaking know. I can't get into the mind of crazy. I can only speculate. Perhaps she suspects that they might show up in force. Durai would be pissed to find out that Scratch called Tower folk to attack their new-found sanctuary. It would be better cover for her if Durai thinks that they just followed a trio of escapees back to the Colony.
I say this is a low probability because it hinges on the Mallers being able to listen in on the Dunbar's communications.

Scenario #2

The Mallers can't listen to the conversations over the encrypted radio communication but they can tell that there are some organized survivors in L.A. because you can still hear the clicks of radio interspersed with the hisses, warbles and other sounds. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xivI6LfF1g
Ape-shit Scratch sees an opportunity to continue her quest to find what ever the hell she's wants from the Tower guys.
Allows some guys to 'escape' who are likely going to look for Michael, Pegs and some other chick.
Why not just call them up and say, "Hey, we have Lizzy!"? Well, this won't work because they won't be able to communicate because of the encryption. Also, I can't get into the mind of crazy. I can only speculate. Perhaps she suspects that they might show up in force. Durai would be pissed to find out that Scratch called Tower folk to attack their new-found sanctuary. It would be better cover for her if Durai thinks that they just followed a trio of escapees back to the Colony.

[Witch_Doctor]

Maybe its because I have tired new dad brain...

Congratulations, sir.:)

[Witch_Doctor]

Assuages? Nice vocab. No sarcasm!! Seriously!! (My mom was an english teacher)

Also - Luke, Han and Leia? Nice.

Why thank you.

[GeneTwo]

So the Dunbar tower is using Police radios and the Mallers are know to have a variety of radios and CB equipment. What if the Mallers have a Police Scanner or something like that. You know you see it all the time in movies, like Die Hard. News companies keeping tabs on the police and their movements.

Hay, what if the Mallers raided a news station for that kind of equipment. I bet the bigger news stations have a big selection of radio gear, CB, Police, Fire, emergency, and what ever you can think of.

[Bullethead]

Im thinking that CJ and Saul are using encrypted police cb's and thats all there is to it. I don't think anyone is meant to read into it as much as we are right now.

It seems more likely to me that if the colony, i.e. mallers, were to rediscover Saul it would be through some other form of communication. Knowing Saul the way we do he is more likely to just contact Scratch himself. She doesn't need to find him, he'll find her.

[nikvoodoo]

Congratulations, sir.:)

Thank you and thank you for the clarification. I'm pickin' up what you're puttin' down now.

[Cabbage Patch]

So the Dunbar tower is using Police radios and the Mallers are know to have a variety of radios and CB equipment. What if the Mallers have a Police Scanner or something like that. You know you see it all the time in movies, like Die Hard. News companies keeping tabs on the police and their movements.

Hay, what if the Mallers raided a news station for that kind of equipment. I bet the bigger news stations have a big selection of radio gear, CB, Police, Fire, emergency, and what ever you can think of.

Those types of scanners only work with older types of police radios that were unencrypted. If you used one on an encrypted radio network you wouldn't be able to hear that anyone was talking. Your only clue that people were using that frequency would be the changes in the signal strength as people keyed their microphones to speak; you don't even hear them breaking squelch!

If you are on an encrypted radio you can hear anyone who comes onto your frequency that is not encrypted. It's actually one of the great annoyances of running encrypted networks, people jumping onto your frequency and talking because they assume no one is on it. So if the Mallers did find the frequency that the Dunbar Tower was using they could send a message, and it could be heard, but the Mallers wouldn't know if their message was heard unless they got an unencrypted response.

[nikvoodoo]

This hasn't been brought up yet, but I want to point out the clock in the background.

To me, it's significant. Otherwise it would have been present in the library the first time. But it wasn't. And now it's here for 11 minutes straight. Quietly counting down to....?

Not only do we then hear about how Saul wears his heart on his sleeve, but you also can hear CJ's heart breaking as Saul continues to plan on leaving her for Lizzy.

Not only that, but how did the chapter end? With the clock ticking on in the silence. And it did not end on the "tock" it ended up the "tick." I like the absolute lack of resolution. It's sort of like that frustrating thing when you're listening to a song and you hear the everything resolving down to that final chord to complete the phrase but someone changes the station. It drives me crazy I know that.

Anyone else have thoughts on the clock and what it might mean to Saul, Cj, and the rest of our survivors?

[Adventureless_Hero]

This hasn't been brought up yet, but I want to point out the clock in the background.

To me, it's significant. Otherwise it would have been present in the library the first time. But it wasn't. And now it's here for 11 minutes straight. Quietly counting down to....?

Not only do we then hear about how Saul wears his heart on his sleeve, but you also can hear CJ's heart breaking as Saul continues to plan on leaving her for Lizzy.

Not only that, but how did the chapter end? With the clock ticking on in the silence. And it did not end on the "tock" it ended up the "tick." I like the absolute lack of resolution. It's sort of like that frustrating thing when you're listening to a song and you hear the everything resolving down to that final chord to complete the phrase but someone changes the station. It drives me crazy I know that.

Anyone else have thoughts on the clock and what it might mean to Saul, Cj, and the rest of our survivors?


o_O I didn't even notice. In truth, I only listened to the episode once. Dude, if there is some kind of ticking theme going on in the background, I feel like that is a HUGE sign to us that something major lies on the horizon. I'm going to have to go back and listen again before I can draw any conclusions though. Thanks Nik!

[Bullethead]

I remember hearing the ticking but I paid no mind to it in all honesty. Thought it was just relevant to the room they were in. I don't have a super theory but my guess is its counting down to someones death.

Not sure why but my feeling is CJ. She might do her best to work with Saul and get him to his love lizzy. Sacrifice herself in the process to ensure that Saul gets to her or maybe gets out of the Colony safely with her.

[EpiEpee]

This hasn't been brought up yet, but I want to point out the clock in the background.

To me, it's significant. Otherwise it would have been present in the library the first time. But it wasn't. And now it's here for 11 minutes straight. Quietly counting down to....?

Not only do we then hear about how Saul wears his heart on his sleeve, but you also can hear CJ's heart breaking as Saul continues to plan on leaving her for Lizzy.

Not only that, but how did the chapter end? With the clock ticking on in the silence. And it did not end on the "tock" it ended up the "tick." I like the absolute lack of resolution. It's sort of like that frustrating thing when you're listening to a song and you hear the everything resolving down to that final chord to complete the phrase but someone changes the station. It drives me crazy I know that.

Anyone else have thoughts on the clock and what it might mean to Saul, Cj, and the rest of our survivors?

I feel as though the clock is significant too-

Aren't we still essentially in a flashback with Saul? My initial thought was that it was simply time catching up to whatever he was referencing. That event probably being his attempt at getting Lizzie back from the Mallers.

Time, in a calendar sense, has also got to be playing a key role in his mind as he tries to figure out if he is the father of Lizzie's baby or not.

/*totally off-my-rocker-thoughts-ahead*/
Or maybe it's a Poe reference to the Tell-Tale Heart? Didn't the noise the protagonist heard in that story, that he felt was the beating of the heart of his victim, turn out to be a clock? And Saul's sense was questioned in this chapter, like the protagonist's sanity was questioned in the poem. /*end of rocker-less thoughts*/

I love the suspense the clock added though!

[nikvoodoo]

If I remember correctly the source I'm the tell tale heart is never revealed.

But I had the same thought upon relistening...Tell Tale Heart was the very first thing I thought of.

[EpiEpee]

[QUOTE=nikvoodoo;43044]If I remember correctly the source I'm the tell tale heart is never revealed.

But I had the same thought upon relistening...Tell Tale Heart was the very first thing I thought of.QUOTE]

I think you are probably right about the source not being revealed now that I think about it some more- I think I saw a staged version at one point that used a very prominent clock as the sound source, so the memory is muddled, leading to my mix-up.

It could, potentially, still be a Poe reference though since there have been Poe references before.

[nikvoodoo]

I think you are probably right about the source not being revealed now that I think about it some more- I think I saw a staged version at one point that used a very prominent clock as the sound source, so the memory is muddled, leading to my mix-up.

It could, potentially, still be a Poe reference though since there have been Poe references before.

I performed the Tell Tale Heart...a lot....in high school. It was the piece I used for National Forensics Tournaments (in conjuntion with the Raven...original, right?). I just looked it back over again (thank you free Edgar Allan Poe Apps!) and there is no mention of clocks.

But I do remember seeing productions myself with a clock in the room as well. I feel like it's the traditional cheap way to try to "throw off" an audience unfamiliar with the story. Or provide those that do know it a way to explain the Narrators breakdown.

[Cabbage Patch]

When CJ and Saul are arguing she hits him with, "You care more about her than your own safety? Or being rescued?" It dawns on me that this is the first time we've heard CJ say anything about being...

[7oddisdead]

this sucks...i need to do another series relisten.

I'm thinking back throughout the series of times when the music or sound effects have played an important role in the story. Times such as the sound of the rain, or burts breathing when taking aim on pinstripes..im thinking if anything, the clock sound is merely a way to heighten the tension of the cj/saul situation...the tension in the room, as it were...if anything, I could see it alluding to their time at Dunbar drawing to a close...but I can't think of another time where KC let sounds predict the story for him...so to say

[Zombiphobe]

It dawns on me that this is the first time we've heard CJ say anything about being rescued.

This stood out to me as well. I got the impression that CJ had Saul and Victor documenting the movements of the helicopter, but didn't necessarily want them making contact with the helicopter. Although, this could have just been her being cautious and general distrustful of outsiders. Afterall, look at Kalani who jumped in the first rescue car that came along after crash landing in LAX.

However, in Episode 28 - Last Dying Breath Part 2 of 3, while discussing the Man in the Pinstripe Suit CJ stated, "This guy, he's still out there, the one who cornered me downstairs and then just left. That's who I'm more interested in."

Perhaps she won't be ready to leave LA until after she takes him out.

[wh33t]

This stood out to me as well. I got the impression that CJ had Saul and Victor documenting the movements of the helicopter, but didn't necessarily want them making contact with the helicopter. Although, this could have just been her being cautious and general distrustful of outsiders. Afterall, look at Kalani who jumped in the first rescue car that came along after crash landing in LAX.

However, in Episode 28 - Last Dying Breath Part 2 of 3, while discussing the Man in the Pinstripe Suit CJ stated, "This guy, he's still out there, the one who cornered me downstairs and then just left. That's who I'm more interested in."

Perhaps she won't be ready to leave LA until after she takes him out.

Honestly here, I think CJ is hurt from some lost loved one dying. I think that explains why she is cold and solitary. I think her mentioning the whole being rescued thing was just a nervous stab at trying to address Sauls compulsive decision to immediately race to the Colony. I think CJ would know that Saul obviously cares very little for his own safety. That's why he's willing to risk himself on all of these errands. I think it's much more likely that CJ is not so much as looking for revenge, but answers to what this all is.

[2bgood]

For my own sake, I am going to completely drop the notion that Glenn and Pete are moles or spies. Pete would have to be one hell of a well trained spy to use reverse psychology so well. Recall that he didn't want anything to do with Saul and Victor. If he were a spy, he would have done his best to be likeable and trust worthy to be privy to any and all information available.
Then there is Glenn. He had no reason to be pissed at Victor, right out. At first he was probably one of the only people living at the colony that knew in his aged heart of hearts that Victor would never try to betray the colony. So when Gatekeeper told the colony folk that Victor and the new arrivals had tried to sabotage the colony, Glen was probably one of the only one's to say, "Now just hold on a second there, fella. I don't think Victor would do such a thing. That nice young man saved my life once."
It wasn't until Glen met up with Victor and Saul did he learn that Victor had intentionally taken all the guns and ammo with him, thereby leaving the colony folk in a lurch.

BUT...there is possibility that Glen and Pete are carrying a tracking device of some sort and don't know it. The Mallers may have been brilliant enough to let Roman, Glen, and Pete think they were escaping when in reality the Mallers just said, let them go, we'll track them later. Although I think it's an unlikely scenario, I do believe it is more probable than Glen and/or Pete being outright spies for the Mallers.

My favorite theory: Glen, Roman, and Pete miraculously escaped from the colony. Roman got turned. Saul and Victor stumble upon Glen and Pete. It's as simple as has been explained to us. :D

Please drop the tracking device idea. In a pre-Z world how many secret tracking devices are kicking around? Not many. There are some GPS solutions around - but no one in WA seems to be using GPS so I assume the satilites link aren't working as GPS's are everywhere pre-Z. It not impossible but it is a real stretch

[wh33t]

Please drop the tracking device idea. In a pre-Z world how many secret tracking devices are kicking around? Not many. There are some GPS solutions around - but no one in WA seems to be using GPS so I assume the satilites link aren't working as GPS's are everywhere pre-Z. It not impossible but it is a real stretch

Yea, I'm starting to doubt the tracking idea too as I originally got behind the idea because it just seemed incredibly unlikely that an old dude and a fool like Pete could escape the Mallers. But after much deliberation I'm mostly in agreement that the Mallers after twice attacking the Tower and losing significant numbers of their force would not be as strong as I originally had thought. Finding the fortress that is the Colony might also be allowing them to relax a bit, which might have aided Glenn and Petes escape. So perhaps it's not so unlikely that Pete and Glenn were able to escape on their own merits.

[Skynet]

Yea, I'm starting to doubt the tracking idea too as I originally got behind the idea because it just seemed incredibly unlikely that an old dude and a fool like Pete could escape the Mallers. But after much deliberation I'm mostly in agreement that the Mallers after twice attacking the Tower and losing significant numbers of their force would not be as strong as I originally had thought. Finding the fortress that is the Colony might also be allowing them to relax a bit, which might have aided Glenn and Petes escape. So perhaps it's not so unlikely that Pete and Glenn were able to escape on their own merits.
I'm not saying I agree with the whole tracking idea, but who is to say they're not just using the same method the tower used to track the Zs back to the arena?

[wh33t]

I'm not saying I agree with the whole tracking idea, but who is to say they're not just using the same method the tower used to track the Zs back to the arena?

I think it's safe to say with out a doubt there is no way they are using the 'exact' same method of tracking as the last trackers made shit tons of noise, they were also large and very noticeable even to a Z. They could be modified though, but then who would have the skills to modify them? Maybe if the Mallers have "tommys" they could pull it off. But yeah... made some other tracking device we haven't heard of yet. I dunno.

[Cabbage Patch]

The tech certainly exists to track Glenn and Pete.

One of the more interesting news stories I watched this weekend involved the tracking devices that were used to follow the guns that were passed on to Mexican drug cartel reps under Operation Wide Receiver during the Bush Administration (the operation ran from 2006 to 2007). These were small enough to hide inside an AR-15 or AK variant so they weren't obvious when the guns were field stripped and didn't interfere with firing. They used RFID technology and could be tracked from 40 miles away by aircraft, a couple of miles from cars.

Something like that would be small enough to hide in the lining of a backpack, in the stock of Glenn's rifle, even in the hollowed out heel of someone's boot, and the carrier would be none-the-wiser. And it wouldn't give off any signal till it was pinged by a search signal on the proper frequency.

I'm not saying this is what the Mallers did, just that they could have done so using equipment that was available at the time.

[wh33t]

The tech certainly exists to track Glenn and Pete.

One of the more interesting news stories I watched this weekend involved the tracking devices that were used to follow the guns that were passed on to Mexican drug cartel reps under Operation Wide Receiver during the Bush Administration (the operation ran from 2006 to 2007). These were small enough to hide inside an AR-15 or AK variant so they weren't obvious when the guns were field stripped and didn't interfere with firing. They used RFID technology and could be tracked from 40 miles away by aircraft, a couple of miles from cars.

Something like that would be small enough to hide in the lining of a backpack, in the stock of Glenn's rifle, even in the hollowed out heel of someone's boot, and the carrier would be none-the-wiser. And it wouldn't give off any signal till it was pinged by a search signal on the proper frequency.

I'm not saying this is what the Mallers did, just that they could have done so using equipment that was available at the time.

And you're saying that it's possible that this technology could still be working almost a year into Zday?

[Cabbage Patch]

And you're saying that it's possible that this technology could still be working almost a year into Zday?

I don't see why not. RFIDs aren't much more than a chip with an antenna attached. Most are passive, and only reflect information when they're hit by the proper interrogator signal (like the security tags that stores use for loss-control, or a pet finder chip), so they don't need batteries and they last forever, but they have very short range. The ones in the bait guns had batteries, and longer range, but their service life would have more to do with when they were activated, not how old they are. The interrogator is a fairly high powered radio, but it draws it's juice from batteries or the vehicle it's in. Neither component relies on satellites or the power grid to work. If the Mallers found a set of them inside a sealed building there's no reason to assume they wouldn't work just fine.

I still don't think this is what is happening, but I think it's definitely possible.

[wh33t]

I don't see why not. RFIDs aren't much more than a chip with an antenna attached. Most are passive, and only reflect information when they're hit by the proper interrogator signal (like the security tags that stores use for loss-control, or a pet finder chip), so they don't need batteries and they last forever, but they have very short range. The ones in the bait guns had batteries, and longer range, but their service life would have more to do with when they were activated, not how old they are. The interrogator is a fairly high powered radio, but it draws it's juice from batteries or the vehicle it's in. Neither component relies on satellites or the power grid to work. If the Mallers found a set of them inside a sealed building there's no reason to assume they wouldn't work just fine.

I still don't think this is what is happening, but I think it's definitely possible.

That RFID implant shit is creepy.

[UndeadSweeper]

Has anyone figure out why this one is called "Short Term Memory"??

[UndeadSweeper]

I don't see why not. RFIDs aren't much more than a chip with an antenna attached. Most are passive, and only reflect information when they're hit by the proper interrogator signal (like the security tags that stores use for loss-control, or a pet finder chip), so they don't need batteries and they last forever, but they have very short range. The ones in the bait guns had batteries, and longer range, but their service life would have more to do with when they were activated, not how old they are. The interrogator is a fairly high powered radio, but it draws it's juice from batteries or the vehicle it's in. Neither component relies on satellites or the power grid to work. If the Mallers found a set of them inside a sealed building there's no reason to assume they wouldn't work just fine.

I still don't think this is what is happening, but I think it's definitely possible.

Yes but to the Maller, they "know" the tower was destroyed and the first tower was "overrun". Why would spend so must time track people if they believe that nothing left?

[wh33t]

Has anyone figure out why this one is called "Short Term Memory"??

I thought it was a give-away personally. I figured it was referencing the fact that Saul can't remember what Lizzy even looks like. It's in the opening dialogue of the chapter.

[wh33t]

Yes but to the Maller, they "know" the tower was destroyed and the first tower was "overrun". Why would spend so must time track people if they believe that nothing left?

What time? If they've got these super high tech tracking devices they don't really need to risk much. They let two dudes leave with some tracking devices attached and that may be all the effort they have to pull off besides watching their position on a screen to see where they stop. I dunno, it's a weak theory but Cabbage was just stating that it's still possible, but not plausible.

As for why they would do it, well Scratch is a lunatic psychopath and Durai is incredibly strategic and militant. Look at how badly they want to find the Fort Irwin crew. Scratch killed Angel, although he was probably gonna die anyways (so we can't be sure it's not some weird family sympathy killing) and now she's most likely torturing Burt to find out. Serial killers don't really respond to the same reasoning regular people do.

[abayarts]

?! It wasn't ME was it?! I'm totally getting paranoid now as I drink quite a bit. But I can't ever see myself bashing WA. Still... it wasn't me was it?!

edit
Oh thank the goddesses. It wasn't me. I did get drunk this weekend but relegated my drunken posts to Battle Royale (japanese awesomeness) and Gaia.

where did you post Battle Royale related stuff?!?! :D

[Adventureless_Hero]

where did you post Battle Royale related stuff?!?! :D

Oh, on my Facebook page. That weekend I got all boozed up and started watching movies at 2:00 a.m. I think I also watched Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark that night. And then Gandhi.

[reaper239]

Oh, on my Facebook page. That weekend I got all boozed up and started watching movies at 2:00 a.m. I think I also watched Indiana Jones and the Raiders of the Lost Ark that night. And then Gandhi.

me and some buddies did that saturday night. we played gears 3 and watched movies till like 6 am.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Talking about drinking and watching movies makes me wonder about Saul and CJ. I know that I often have movie nights at my pad and invite friends over. But on one occasion I invited my friends over and they all cancelled, with the exception of a female friend of mine. Flash forward a few months and now she and I are dating and living together.

Saul and CJ watch movies together. It's a hell of a bonding experience. Plus we've seen how Saul gets when he drinks. I dunno. I have a lot of faith in the guy and really dig how much of a romantic heart he has, fighting against all odds to get back with Lizzy, but who knows what goes on in the rooms at Dunbar Hotel after Victor and the 12 kitty cats have gone mee-mees.

[Bullethead]

im with you A_H something had to have happened. Its been a few months. Doesn't victor even at some point stop and ask saul "what about CJ?"

Im not saying saul is a bad person if he did do something. But it will be interesting to find out what happened in the 4 month down time at the Dunbar Tower. It will probably take a chapter or two as we will probably be going back to Burt and Scratch, or Michael and Riley in the near future.

[mem]

*random insertion of my pitiful knowledge*
I waited to listen to this chapter all 3 parts at once. I am glad I did. I was starting to get a little bored with what was happening and needed the break. Listening to the 3 parts all at once helped to get me back on track with why I love this podcast so much. You hear things in earlier episodes and think "ok why did we need to hear/know that" and thennnnnnn (NO and then ! *sorry*) BAM it all makes sense. Almost like the writer was building up to something and then it smacks you right in the face ! Big props to all involved in getting this podcast into our earholes! Thanks for getting me back on track with the story and loving what will happen around the next bend.

[Gadge80]

Im thinking that CJ and Saul are using encrypted police cb's and thats all there is to it. I don't think anyone is meant to read into it as much as we are right now.


Muwahahaha.... you really think there is nothing else going on here? That Glenn and Pete just happen to bump into Saul and Victor in the middle of LA?
I've never been to LA, but I'm sure it's not like strolling around a supermarket.
Glenn and Pete would have had to have seen the helicopter the first time and would have had to camp out, just as Saul and Victor did to be in the general area when the helicopter came back, otherwise the chances of them being in that area when the helicopter did come back would be slim to none.
And then the chances of them actually finding each other in the dark (gun shots echoing through the streets or not) with a horde of zombies on their tails is extremely unlikely.

My guess is Glenn and Pete knew exactly where Saul and Victor were, have been following them for some time and saw the perfect opportunity to "coincidently" come to Sauls assistance - thus instantly gaining trust. All that giba-jaba about not letting them in was a BIG FLUFFY act! :)

[Natagora]

I fuckin' love Victor!

[Robzombie]

They did'nt come to anyones assistance....????? They had a spot baricaded that ended up being near (within hearing distance) to Saul and Victor.

[drlolzphd]

been catching up with the past few episodes and maybe it's because i've been listening to them all at once, but goddamn this show can really drag a person back in. Loved CJ in this episode, the voice acting was fantastic and her conveyance of emotion was so subtle yet so noticeable, Pete is somewhat of a dick, but justified, and Victor and Saul are quickly becoming the best zombie bro-squad of the new millennia. The relationship between Saul and CJ are nice and all, but i think the relationship between Saul and Victor is gonna lead to some underhanded tactic by Mr.Weyland himself to force us all to experience a tearful goodbye.

[Solanine]

I'm doing it more in reaction/to get a reaction out of the Greg Miller fan boys! ;)

Trolololololololol.

However, since he brought up the whole Lizzy thing he's been pretty agreeable. I just still don't think things are going to end well for him.

It takes more than that Nick. BEYOND!

[Solanine]

This if the first "meat"-less episode that I've really enjoyed. I still enjoyed it much less than the action filled episodes, but you can't always have action.

First off, I love Victor. Him and Saul are so bromantic. I can't think of too many other films where two dudes have such an enjoyable hetero friendship, maybe the Boondock Saints comes close though. Obviously CJ is in a tight spot. Her training keeps her alive, but we all know that there is more to being human than just eating, sleeping and staying out of harms way. Love always finds a way. It's clear that she has some feelings for at least Saul, but maybe there is soft spot in her heart for Victor too, but maybe it's more brotherly. Honestly, knowing what we know about KC I'm not sure at all what is going to happen with these love triangle. KC is the kind of guy to just kill off Lizzy in after the baby is born and then Saul and CJ become a major ass kicking item... Or maybe KC kills off CJ? KC, damn you, you reckless bastard.

I'm stoked that Pete and Glenn are gonna survive. I don't personally sense any double-crossing from these two, but once again ya never know. The Mallers can be very persuasive and they seriously injured Pippen to aid in his disguise. Not only that, but Scratch is a lunatic and Durai is a cold hearted strategist. I think Glenn has something important to contribute to the crew if they'd just let him speak.

As for the little ones, did I understand correctly that they "came back to life"? Wasn't Roman bit or killed, then turned into a little one, attacked them at the door, and then killed and then shot in the head (killed presumably) in the morning?

Thats inteeresting, I really enjoy the "Meatless" episodes, sometimes more than the actual action its self. It fleshes out the charecters and allows you to empathise with them. And the anticipation of the storm to come is awesome.

[Gadge80]

They did'nt come to anyones assistance....????? They had a spot baricaded that ended up being near (within hearing distance) to Saul and Victor.

They had enough time to find a place close to Saul and Victor whilst they camped out waiting for the helicopter to return.
It wasn't even a good place as they couldn't even get the door to close. Any fortification seen there could have easily been the reminiscence of early stage survivors.

Im just saying, a very loud helicopter flys in, lots of machine gun and nice bright flares all screaming like a big pink neon sign reading "zombie food here!" and then for some reason, from a near by school, shots are heard...?

Sounds to me like all the zombies had their sights set on the helicopter site... but then why all the gun shots from the school? And when Saul and Victor get there all the zombies are chasing Saul and Victor...there aren't even any zombies at the school doors... so what were they shooting at?
Mix that up with all the stuff I said about LA being a big place etc... and try and tell me they weren't trying to get Saul's attention?

I'm 100% almost positively not absolutely sure that my theory is correct :)