Chapter 29-2 Beyond Our Walls Part 2

[nikvoodoo]

It's Monday, Monday/The show's released on this day!

.......


I'll now receive your stoning.....

[nikvoodoo]

I'm shocked.....A Rebecca Black parody/reference has been sitting here for 1.5 hours with no "groan" or "oh christmas" or "really, bro?"

I'm shocked at everyone's self control ;)

[awkwardalex]

I'm shocked.....A Rebecca Black parody/reference has been sitting here for 1.5 hours with no "groan" or "oh christmas" or "really, bro?"

I'm shocked at everyone's self control ;)

Did ya hear did ya hear? Michael's a six headed alien!

[awkwardalex]

Just finished: GODDAMN YOU KC WAYLAND!!!

Tears laughs and a frustrated groan!

How many hours till next week.

[Chogidog]

"and Kelly is... Kelly... and she's - great."
lmao

[UndeadSweeper]

"and Kelly is... Kelly... and she's - great."
lmao

"It ok" to Datu LOL

[Merlin1274]

Man that was a frustrating Episode. Now we know she was bit.

[UndeadSweeper]

Man that was a frustrating Episode. Now we know she was bit.

But I hope everyone take a notice that everyone made their choose.

Also Micheal wasn't "forced" in to serve. He choose to serve and had a duty to serve.

[fridginators]

A nice pat on the back for everyone on the forums for successfully predicting Tanya being bit from waaaaaaaay back. I reckon this is from her bandage, not from Randy; otherwise they would say she's been infected. It's too straightforward for Michael to be like "oh it must have been with Randy" and for that to be the case - he's got to be like "I think I know... oh wait what the hell is going on here!"

Top episode, although I'm never a fan of breakup/emotional turmoil scenes because I always think they're a little bit unreal. Still, it was well done, and it was a solid episode - information overload with the Colonel!

[Adventureless_Hero]

I found it difficult to tolerate Michael being so selfish. But I also found it crappy that Pegs suddenly went cold. I guess her desperation to return to a "normal" life was that great. I don't blame Pegs or any of the others for their decision. I do think it was pretty crappy of Michael to try to guilt trip some of them into staying. I can understand his want for them to remain behind after all they have been through, but he was too damn childish in his acceptance of it. In all fairness though, he probably feels abandoned.

So Tanya has been bitten, or so that is what the examiners believe. It may be that she bears the bite marks of an animal back from her time as a Veterinarian or actually did received a bite from one of the creatures she experimented on, or even from the scrap she went through with Randy and his group of biters. Who knows?!

I'm curious to see if the story will follow the crew at Boulder, Colorado (Na-Nu Na-Nu!!!).

Did anyone else think that Kimmet was lying when he said he knew nothing about the "cause of it?"

[Hollomandious]

I think we're about to understand a little more about why Saul didn't turn & can breathe at ground zero. Some kind of immunity that runs in the family, and only Tanya knows cause she got bit at some point and didn't turn.

I have a little different thought on the Michael/Pegs break up. It seems to me that it was more of a "we're breaking up, and saying eff you so that it's easier," kinda thing. Tho, the guilt trip from Michael was a bit BS.

Think we're gonna get stories from Boulder? Or will it be left as a big black hole of speculation (like wherever the mallers are w/ our peoples).

[Chogidog]

Some things i picked up on..

1) Special Op's? Zed Recon trips?
2) 'ALL' Active duty is HQ'd @ Ft Irwin? The rest of the US military is wiped out? Damn
3) The Box? where Puck got his blood stripes? Zed's kept for training?
4) No Air Force mentioned in the services?
5) All the Hot spots seem to be along the ring of fire and spread out from there?
6) They aren't aware of the colony as a safe spot
7) The Kelly line is still funny after a few re-listens

[nikvoodoo]

Well that is certainly one way to deal with exposition and still make it awesome, now ain't it?

Damn...just damn. If this is truly the last time we see Datu, Pegs, Kelly and Hope I'm gonna have a big sad. Either the story branches off to them too, or Burt and Angel come back soon because I don't know if I can handle it! Please note: This is the first time I'm begging to get those characters back....you know we've reached critical if I'm begging for an Angel return!

I'm going to leave most of the posting to the rest of you, but I do believe that we have one of the best opportunities yet to have the story cross over from remembering and real time. Michael said he'd have to write down what he remembered and if he had stopped his journal writing before, maybe this is what gets it started again...

.....because now he has to. Because it's his job. And he has been tasked with analyzing the data.

[awkwardalex]

"and Kelly is... Kelly... and she's - great."
lmao

I know best line.

[awkwardalex]

A nice pat on the back for everyone on the forums for successfully predicting Tanya being bit from waaaaaaaay back. I reckon this is from her bandage, not from Randy; otherwise they would say she's been infected. It's too straightforward for Michael to be like "oh it must have been with Randy" and for that to be the case - he's got to be like "I think I know... oh wait what the hell is going on here!"

Top episode, although I'm never a fan of breakup/emotional turmoil scenes because I always think they're a little bit unreal. Still, it was well done, and it was a solid episode - information overload with the Colonel!

I agree the voice acting in this scene was amazing.

[Adventureless_Hero]

I was thinking the journal writing was going to end around here. I imagined it was going to go into mostly real time with small episodes of journal entry or flashbacks.

I don't know if the story will fragment and continue over at Boulder, Colorado, but I'm hopeful. I'd like to see how things are going over there, especially with such a big population, and Mork.

After relistening, I still think Kimmet is lying about knowing more about the cause of the outbreak. I'm amazed at the astounding rate at which the pandemic spanned the nation: one and a half days! Also, if the Philippines had thier own hotspot, then I have little hope for Datu's family. : (

Okay, so in regards to the chapter art, I see how the plane departing came into the story, but now my concern is over the silhouetted figures returning. That can't just be Riley. Maybe it is representative of Saul and Victor, or maybe even Burt and Angel?

Kimmet said they established pretty decent range of communication. Though it seems they focused their efforts on communicating with areas to the East. If Michael had the gumption to radio folks to the West, he just might be able to get Saul and Victor's attention (and very likely the attention of the Colony and Mallers).

I also want to take a moment to say, Way to go Riley, you bad ass! The French...who knew?! Also, Puck is shaping up to be quite the cool guy. I sense in him a strong soldier and a loyal friend...for now.

[awkwardalex]

Well that is certainly one way to deal with exposition and still make it awesome, now ain't it?

Damn...just damn. If this is truly the last time we see Datu, Pegs, Kelly and Hope I'm gonna have a big sad. Either the story branches off to them too, or Burt and Angel come back soon because I don't know if I can handle it! Please note: This is the first time I'm begging to get those characters back....you know we've reached critical if I'm begging for an Angel return!

I'm going to leave most of the posting to the rest of you, but I do believe that we have one of the best opportunities yet to have the story cross over from remembering and real time. Michael said he'd have to write down what he remembered and if he had stopped his journal writing before, maybe this is what gets it started again...

.....because now he has to. Because it's his job. And he has been tasked with analyzing the data.


Ah nicvoodoo misses Angel someone the Ra1th!

[HardKor]

Wow. Ok its sucks to see so many characters go but I seriously doubt this is the last we've heard of them. But it might be the last we hear from them for awhile. We've now got three confirmed groups of out original Tower folks plus Burt, Angel and Lizzie who are MIA but could be a fourth. Might be that the group headed for Boulder drops off the radar for awhile only to reappear out of the blue to save Michael's ass later. (I can just see Pegs flying in over the horizon to save Michael from a horde of zombies)
On a side note, when they said the safe zone was in Boulder did anyone else have flashbacks to "The Stand"? I know I did.

[Raven]

On a side note, when they said the safe zone was in Boulder did anyone else have flashbacks to "The Stand"? I know I did.

YES yes I did! I was so ready for them to call it Safe Zone

[Nathan.Luiz]

Well, I wasn't expecting that. Interesting that there is a large number of survivors now out in Boulder, and I really hope we hear the story from a 3rd perspective in Boulder, as I think there will be some interesting things happening out there.

Am I right in saying Puck was scratched by Tanya in the last chapter part? If so, I worry for him...

[Cabbage Patch]

Another amazing episode! It's hard to imagine the United States reduced to one city of 150,000 and one military base in the Mojave Desert!

I'm amazed that Pegs was given the choice to leave. I would have thought COL Kimmet would have drafted a competent helicopter pilot on the spot, civilian or not.

Is anyone else holding out hope that one or more of the Tower survivors has a change of heart and gets off the plane before it takes off? I'm hoping the three (four?) figures in the distance in the Chapter artwork are our people coming back.

[HardKor]

Is anyone else holding out hope that one or more of the Tower survivors has a change of heart and gets off the plane before it takes off? I'm hoping the three (four?) figures in the distance in the Chapter artwork are our people coming back.

I was hoping for that too. Maybe Pegs would change her mind and start fighting to be let off. But the plane already took off and was in the air before Michael and Riley turned to leave so not much hope for that.

[trubkir]

Just got through the episode for the first time. I was frustrated that Michael was allowed to leave the briefing. He had till the next morning to talk with his people why the hell would a Colonel allow him to leave in the middle of the briefing. I know that this is a fictional story but I would think that the Kimmet would want his new asset up to speed and working ASAP and that he would have little compassion about Micheal's musings for the civilians he came with.

The Coast Guard was the first to get their poop together was another hint I got out of this. I have often wondered about the naval situation. Ships at sea wouldn't be affected right off the bat so I was wondering if there are strong seaborne forces to augment what is left of the ragtag bunch on land. I would think submarines would have been the safest place at the time of "the event." The big missile subs would have quite a large nuclear capability too.

[TheLostBigBoss]

I think the group will be staying for a little longer. Tanya was/is infected, no way they would let people near her go to the last known bastion of humanity without more medical inspection and evaluation. They know they have slow turners/carriers on their hands, they aren't going anywhere.

[Cabbage Patch]

I have often wondered about the naval situation. Ships at sea wouldn't be affected right off the bat so I was wondering if there are strong seaborne forces to augment what is left of the ragtag bunch on land. I would think submarines would have been the safest place at the time of "the event." The big missile subs would have quite a large nuclear capability too.

I agree that the status of Navy ships that were at sea at the time of the outbreak is a huge question. And crews in ICBM silos and underground command centers, etc. I suspect that the fact that they weren't mentioned in COL Kimmet's briefing means that they either didn't make it or they are not in contact with Fort Irwin.

[phobiarg]

I agree that the status of Navy ships that were at sea at the time of the outbreak is a huge question. And crews in ICBM silos and underground command centers, etc. I suspect that the fact that they weren't mentioned in COL Kimmet's briefing means that they either didn't make it or they are not in contact with Fort Irwin.


Thank you Kc for putting the Coast Guard in a good light. It always seems like we're the subject of the jokes and are always the ones to either cause more bad than good or are just a joke compared to other branches. I was literally cheering in my truck on my way home from base today because my branch got props from Kimmet.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Although Boulder and Ft. Irwin sound to be the last refuge of human life on the continental United States, keep in mind Col. Kimmet did state that they haven't had any other contact. He might not know about the Colony but it exists, which would make it reasonable to assume that other such pockets of civilization exist. There might be some Fort out in Florida, Texas, and/or somewhere on the East coast doing well, just in a situation where they can't contact each other.

That's why they need to get some douche bag like Kevin Costner to run snail mail across the country!

[reaper239]

there goes datu... crying again... for the last time :_(

[7oddisdead]

Hmm...

Anyone else get the feeling we may have just heard the beginnings of the mallers/ other tower hatred?..picture this. Coast guard lands at lax..mallers want to get on..fight ensues...cj and Sean survivealong with a couple others..set up other tower. Boom.

Hey, nobody else has said it...i just had to:)

[Adventureless_Hero]

On thinking of other pockets of civilization, isn't there like this Mountain where all the high profile members of the executive branch and stuff supposed to go in the event of a hell-on-earth emergency? Or am I just thinking of Terminator 3 too much? Seriously though, isn't there some Mountain bunker currently in use where they store the countries secrets on mainframes and shit miles below rock?

[nikvoodoo]

On thinking of other pockets of civilization, isn't there like this Mountain where all the high profile members of the executive branch and stuff supposed to go in the event of a hell-on-earth emergency? Or am I just thinking of Terminator 3 too much? Seriously though, isn't there some Mountain bunker currently in use where they store the countries secrets on mainframes and shit miles below rock?

You're not making it up.

http://www.norad.mil/

NORAD located in Colorado. That covers the deep buried bunker part.

As for the information.....*shrug* There's something they don't want you to know....

[Eviebae]

Another amazing episode! It's hard to imagine the United States reduced to one city of 150,000 and one military base in the Mojave Desert!
I had the opposite reaction--that many made it? Yay! They have enough military to have a base? Yay.2!

General Thoughts (you don't have to salute)
Personally, it immediately made me nervous that they'd put all humanity's eggs in one basket. I mean if Bolder Fails...

Didn't Puck get injured by Tanya? Nurse Brum gave him ice for it so maybe it was just a bruise. If did get scratched, he hasn't turned yet!
I hope she gets a chance to explain before they shoot her. She must know she's immune and might know why.

Whatever the reason for Saul and Tanya's immunity--they must be part of a small portion of the population. After all, Colorado would have had access to the same medicines that Tanya did. But if only a small number of people could respond to a cure and/or were naturally resistant or immune to the cause--it would obviously fail on most people. Unless you chose one of the resistant people to treat, you'd never see it. Being immune rather than fighting off something temporarily also makes sense in that Saul didn't turn when exposed to a super dose of the haze.--something that might have overwhelmed an acquired immunity (maybe that's another reason CJ sent them?) The slow turner could have been partially resistant (only one recessive gene) or didn't have access to the cure.

One thing, if there was an explosion large enough to make cracks in the earth all over the world; why no earthquakes? Heck, even with explosions that big there'd be vibrations felt all over and no one mentions feeling any.

Did anyone spot the manipulation of Michael from the Col? You don't find out what's going on unless you sign...but it turns out that everyone else in the group found out just by passing the physical. I know, I know, he was under threat so it was both a carrot and a stick, but still. Most of what he was told even Puck knew. Maybe once the people leave he'll find out additional info.

Yeah, being in the army sucks, but it's such a pure example of the need for defense. Still, she almost fell apart over shooting Latch so maybe Pegs is fundamentally unfit. I'm betting one or some of them come back once they've rested. I wonder if they'll write each other?

So far the mechanism reminds me of a series of books I've been reading. Cheryl Priest has a Steampunk/Zombie series set in an alternate civil war. In it, Seattle is a walled "dead" city due to a volcanic/underground gas that has been released by tunneling. The gas immediately turns people into zombies. However, people process it into powder and sell it as a cheap drug...and I'm sure you can see what happens with that. Personally, I don't think the similarity hurts We're Alive as they are both original works and very different from one another. It just adds to the canon.

[Adventureless_Hero]

You're not making it up.

http://www.norad.mil/

NORAD located in Colorado. That covers the deep buried bunker part.

As for the information.....*shrug* There's something they don't want you to know....


Thanks man! I was going crazy trying to remember what it was called. For some reason I kept thinking it started with a /T/. Curse you Mt. Tartarus!

Um, wtf? I keep trying to google map Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado to get an idea of how far it is from Boulder, but the fecking thing keeps showing Peterson AFB as being in Ohio? What the feck?

So anyway, North American Aerospace Defense Command appears to be near Colorado Springs, Colorado. A mere 100 miles south of Boulder. I wonder if there is anything there?

[HardKor]

Yeah, being in the army sucks, but it's such a pure example of the need for defense. Still, she almost fell apart over shooting Latch so maybe Pegs is fundamentally unfit. I'm betting one or some of them come back once they've rested. I wonder if they'll write each other?


Yeah the whole Michael/Pegs being separated thing makes me think of the a soldier leaving for (or in this case staying at) the front lines while a loved one stays behind (or leaves for) the home front. And I think you may have thought of the perfect way for us to find out about what's going on in Boulder: letters!

[Cabbage Patch]

NORAD located in Colorado. That covers the deep buried bunker part.

I suspect you won't find anybody home at NORAD. They've probably all bugged out via the Stargate.

[nikvoodoo]

I suspect you won't find anybody home at NORAD. They've probably all bugged out via the Stargate.

Nah....they're there.

They're just locked in a never ending struggle with Joshua and games of Tic Tac Toe.

[Adventureless_Hero]

@ Nik and Cabbage Patch... really guys? LOL!!!!

[zombiesurvivor]

I feel bad for Saul
I hate that they are making micheal stay while the others have to be shipped out.
It sucks that thy have to be separated
Hopefully not long

[awkwardalex]

Dammit all. This episode was amazing and awful in the best way.


"Oh look Datu's crying again."

[UndeadSweeper]

I suspect you won't find anybody home at NORAD. They've probably all bugged out via the Stargate.

Just what we need zombie Egyptian gods and jafar. But if that meant RDA joined We're Alive crew all will be forgiven.

Datu "I'm going to crying"
O'Neill "Oh for crying out loud!"

COL Kimmet "Who do you think you are?"
O'Neill "Does it say Colonel anywhere on my uniform?"

[awkwardalex]

Oh wait best line updated:...Riley hell of a shot with a bow [when she isn't drunk]

Oh admit it you saw the video and thought it to.

[Pandora]

It is all good..I think they are going to be forced into going towards Saul or the Mallers..he wouldnt want Pegs there anyways. Did Riley and Kelly even say buh bye?

[Litmaster]

What a nice episode... really broadened the story out in lots of new directions, so here goes:

Here There Be Dragons...
I had this sense of awe come over when hearing about distant places and the fragmented web of humanity that still survives... 150,000 in Boulder? Special Ops Teams?? Irwin as a forward operating base??? Our little story, which started from a little college in Southern LA, has now broadened out to parts beyond... for the longest time, our little map had one little spot of color, surrounded by all white, uncharted, unknown territory, marked 'Here There Be Dragons'... and now that white space is starting to get filled in...


The Outbreak Started Along the Ring of Fire...
So it was Chogidog, I believe, who was the first to first to post here that many of the 'hotspots' Kimmet mentioned were along the Ring of Fire (http://www.worldatlas.com/aatlas/infopage/ringfire.htm). Even though my first guess at the cause of the outbreak was bio-terrorism, the Ring of Fire thing and the cracks led me to think that maybe the zombie outbreak was caused by some kind of toxic strain of volcanic smog (http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/007468.htm).... A quick listing of the hotspot cities that Kimmet mentioned supports the Ring of Fire / Vog theory:


LA, San Diego, (2 in SF area), Oregon (Portland?), Seattle, Japan, China, Phillipines. Also add Hawaii to the list.


...Uh, Unless the Outbreak Didn't Start Along the Ring of Fire...
So all looks good for the Ring of Fire thing. However, way back in Ch. 2-3 ("The Two Things"), at 2:23, when they are listening to the TIVO of the news broadcasts about the outbreak, the following cities are mentioned as having 'rioting':


LA, San Diego, Detroit, Houston, Chicago, New York

So check for the first 2 on the list, but the other 4 cities are not on the Ring of Fire. Also, this news broadcast was made as shit was hitting the fan in LA, so that seems to contradict Kimmet's information that the outbreak started purely on the west coast and then spread east. So which is the truth?
- Could it be that the rioting in Detroit, Houston, Chicago, and NY was caused simply due to panic but not yet zombies?
- And how could the outbreak spread so fast across the country (1 1/2 days, according to Kimmet), if traffic jams and gridlock would keep everybody pretty much locked into their own cities?


Departures
Aaaah, nothing like a tearful departure scene to jerk at the heart-strings... or cause one to retch in disgust, depending on how it is handled. So props to Kc for handling the scene with emotion but without dissolving into melodrama. That scene could have come off as really cheezy if mis-handled...

So great, a now-single Michael is going to be even more of an emotionally constipated asshole than ever. Thanks, Pegs. Stay away from those flower pots, girl.
And pretty cold on the part of Pegs, huh? That was a weird relationship from the start...


Who Will the Narration Follow?
I, for one, hope that Pegs & Co. fly off into the sunset, and we don't hear from them again, perhaps with the exception of an occasional letter or shocking news report that Boulder has been overrun. I don't think they will be back, or should. They have fulfilled their role, so keeping them around just to keep the band together is kind of dumb. Remember, the story started with Michael, Saul, and Angel, so I think the narration should stick with those three.


[And yeah, Kc, we all know that Angel is still alive, so quit bullshitting us and get Shane back in the studio, will ya??? You know when even Nik starts missing Angel, you have kept the character out of the limelight a bit too long!]


Tanya Bitten
And last but not least, the Worst-Kept Secret in the Story Award goes to.... Tanya has been bitten!!!! It seems like we called that about 14 episodes ago. So related to that:

Tanya probably got bit back in the Colony but kept it hidden. In the process, she discovered that she was able to prevent herself from turning by a certain drug cocktail...
Tanya probably tried the same thing on other patients, but it failed to work, thus making her hesitant to tell others about her new 'vaccine'
It wouldn't surprise me to find that Tanya had somehow saved Hope with the same drug cocktail...
...and, of course, she gave some to Saul when she was treating him back at the Tower.
...and now the cat wil be out of the bag, with Mike going to bat for her and eventually convincing Kimmet to recruit Tanya as an Army medical researcher...
...Tanya was eventually come upon a workable vaccine, which will end the story with it beginning to be distributed.



Whew! All right, I know it's large, but I tried to make it easy to skim the main points...

[Pandora]

I am SURE our Gov. has bunkers everywhere...they would take their families and their teenage daughter boyfriends to in the even of as you said a hell on earth emergency.

[Pandora]

DAYUMM...some of you guys write flippin BOOKS on here! I will read it as I can...I cant stare at monitors too long or I get the evil migraine.


Hahahahah Litmaster! I like it! Maybe if we all quote Lit KC will actually see it!


Quote;[And yeah, Kc, we all know that Angel is still alive, so quit bullshitting us and get Shane back in the studio, will ya??? You know when even Nik starts missing Angel, you have kept the character out of the limelight a bit too long!]

[Cabbage Patch]

Pegs is gone. We'll miss her, but she made her choice. Michael needs to start hanging out at Weed Army Community Hospital and get to know nurse Britt better. It sounds like she's a civilian after-all, so he doesn't have to deal with that whole rank-disparity thing.

[Osiris]

I have got so much to say about this episode that I'm going to have to blog it. It'll be too much for one thread. I just... I... this is... aw fuck it.

[TheNoelWilliams]

Hey all, first time poster here. Finally caught up, so sad, need a hug. Dammm u pegs and Michael

[Osiris]

I was sitting here, thinking about the plane flying off into the sunset, and it occurred to me that I was hoping the plane goes down. It gives Michael a reason to head off on a mission to recover survivors. It also provides the story with that Henry Blake moment that is always a good way to cut a character out of a show without any loose threads dangling. As far as Pegs being rather cold in her decision? Most women I've known have that mechanism that facilitates ending a relationship without tears and screaming (thank God). I think she was simply divorcing herself emotionally in order to maintain composure, while keeping Michael from entertaining the idea that she might simply come to her senses.

I'm going to miss Kelly. She really grew on me. I won't miss Datu. I'm just glad that I won't have to listen to him weep anymore. Jesus, he cried more than Pegs, Riley and Samantha put together.

[Osiris]

Hey all, first time poster here. Finally caught up, so sad, need a hug. Dammm u pegs and Michael

Hey, welcome aboard! Be sure and pop over to the Introduction Thread (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?14-Introduce-Yourself%21) and say hi! :D

[Kunja]

Wow... I honestly don't think I have ever turned on a character as fast as I did on Michael... He really turned into a crybaby in this episode! I actually laughed and cheered on Pegs when she dumped him!!! actually makes me miss Angel's whining!

1849
Go on and cry you little crybaby!

[cupcakezombie]

Not much to add on what has already been said, but a couple of things that I noticed.

Interesting about this Box name. Michael said that he had been there, but he didn't know it. It seems likely if there was a general nickname for it, if you had been there you would have heard it.
So, is it possible it was added after the outbreak. If it was there are a few possible reasons that I can see:
- Made to match the Sandbox name.
- Because that is where the newbies are trained.
- Or there is something more out that has meant it gained the nickname.

I also find Michael's wording interesting as the plane flies off with the other. He says "And just like that they were gone. She was gone. And I was the idiot who let her go".
It strikes me that especially that last part, still sounds like someone that is writing about the past with a bit of perspective. The phrasing to me doesn't sound like something he would be writing on the day it happened. And, could this potentially be some foreshadowing and not just a broken heart talking? If things are good for Pegs in her new location, he is only looking back sadly. But if things take a turn for the worse, then this takes on a different meaning.

...Or I have been hanging out with you crack pot theory people too much and am now reading way too much into things.

P.S. If they find Saul again, he is going to be mad that they took Lady! :p

[Nitara]

I'm not a huge fan of drama. Even so, this was a good episode. It was nice to finally get some info about what was going on.

I was really surprised at how Michael acted. I figured he'd be upset that the others would leave, but I didn't think he'd try to make them feel guilty about it.

As for the journals, Datu already said he'd continue to write in his. That makes me think we'll get to see some of what's going on in Bolder.

I'm really looking forward to next week's episode. Can't wait to see what happens with Tanya.

[kairon00]

I might not be the first one to bring this up but didn't we learn that Europe is possibly compromised from the TiVo in chapter 3. Riots or something like that. As we learned most of the world is compermised. It leaves Canada, South America, Australia, Africa and Russia that we don't know the status of. Multiple hotspots is interesting. It seems to be only big metropolitan areas that are hotspots. Particularly seaside ones. So the leaked gas theory seems a little far fetched now. Giant squids (aka Cthluthlu) therory could still work as only seaborn major cites have been fully confirmed. Virus therory is still viable. Too many variables still to have a source not to mention another season. As a previous post stated the colony has not been mentioned by the military. This chapter. My personal prediction at this point is Fort Irwin is attacked and damaged or destroyed so the tower group can escape ala the colony. This then would force the tower survivors to go back to LA to scavenge for food and other supplies.

[Red Shirt]

...Uh, Unless the Outbreak Didn't Start Along the Ring of Fire...
So all looks good for the Ring of Fire thing. However, way back in Ch. 2-3 ("The Two Things"), at 2:23, when they are listening to the TIVO of the news broadcasts about the outbreak, the following cities are mentioned as having 'rioting':

LA, San Diego, Detroit, Houston, Chicago, New York


I don't think that it is strictly related to the Ring of Fire alone. It is just that that particular area of the planet is, shall we say, a bit more obvious in its seismic activity.

Houston is riddled with faults (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/04/080424153833.htm) and Northwest Houston is apparently sinking (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/09/100928122604.htm).

New York Has a fault right under 125th street. (http://www.pacepress.org/features/manhattan-walks-on-the-125th-street-fault-line-1.1501940#.T6h_lMXWZrk)

Detroit & Chicago

Close enough to the New Madrid (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Madrid_Seismic_Zone) and Wabash Vally (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wabash_Valley_Seismic_Zone) Fault Complex/Seismic Zones in the Reelfoot Rift (http://quake.ualr.edu/public/reelfoot.htm), that there could easily be undiscovered tangential faults. There could even be undiscovered fault complexes further north, as it has been noted that New Madrid activity is slowing and Wabash Vally is increasing. Like something is moving north.

Point of note: the two big quakes in New Zealand recently were on a previously undiscovered fault. I'd be curious to see what the status of other seismically active areas is in WA. Places like Iceland, the north Mediterranean and the Horn of Africa.

My research into this for the reply and for a fan fic I am working on revealed the Brevard Fault Zone in Atlanta. Cuts right through northwest metro, parallel to the Chattahoochee river and apparently the southeast border of my county. Snap.

[nikvoodoo]

I might not be the first one to bring this up but didn't we learn that Europe is possibly compromised from the TiVo in chapter 3. Riots or something like that. As we learned most of the world is compermised. It leaves Canada, South America, Australia, Africa and Russia that we don't know the status of. Multiple hotspots is interesting. It seems to be only big metropolitan areas that are hotspots. Particularly seaside ones. So the leaked gas theory seems a little far fetched now. Giant squids (aka Cthluthlu) therory could still work as only seaborn major cites have been fully confirmed. Virus therory is still viable. Too many variables still to have a source not to mention another season. As a previous post stated the colony has not been mentioned by the military. This chapter. My personal prediction at this point is Fort Irwin is attacked and damaged or destroyed so the tower group can escape ala the colony. This then would force the tower survivors to go back to LA to scavenge for food and other supplies.

Welcome to the forums!

Chapter 2 you're thinking of. 2-3 right at the end.

One reason that hotspots appear in the cities first is simply because that's where populations are densest and are more likely to have media outlets to cover the outbreak. If an outbreak happened in the middle of a field in Idaho it would take a hot minute or week until the rest of us would become aware of it.

As for the Colony taking over Irwin....I really don't see it. Think of it this way: Irwin is way too far away for the Colony who seems pretty content to stay within their safe confines. Not to mention Kimmet already gave us a way to create the conflict with the Colony/Mallers: They are trying to retake ground. If Irwin tries to retake LA that seems a far more likely scenario to bring these folks together for a good ol' fashioned feudin'.This keeps Irwin safe, and we still have the conflict we're clamoring for!

[Kc]

Interesting about this Box name.

Not to discourage anything, but "The Box" is just local lingo in Irwin for the Area to the north of the base that is used for training purposes. It's huge. Michael's reaction was my reaction. "Oh? I never heard it called that before", but all the locals do.

[cupcakezombie]

Not to discourage anything, but "The Box" is just local lingo in Irwin for the Area to the north of the base that is used for training purposes. It's huge. Michael's reaction was my reaction. "Oh? I never heard it called that before", but all the locals do.

See, I have been spending too much time with the crack potters. :)

[7oddisdead]

"crack potters"...l like it.

[Osiris]

Crack?

[nikvoodoo]

I hear there's lots of it in Inglewood

[Osiris]

Ladies and gentlemen,

We have an official cause for the outbreak: crack cocaine.

Investigators uncovered a drug lab earlier this week, taking several young males into custody that ranged in age from 13 to 47. We are please to report that the suspects were brought in without incident and a cure is currently being distributed to surrounding counties.

Thank you,
World Police.

[Hellbringer]

Thank you Kc for putting the Coast Guard in a good light. It always seems like we're the subject of the jokes and are always the ones to either cause more bad than good or are just a joke compared to other branches. I was literally cheering in my truck on my way home from base today because my branch got props from Kimmet.

I've never seen the Coast Guard in a bad light... except when Aston Kutcher is around.

[Hellbringer]

Crack?


In Inglewood.

Dang it, Nik beat me to it!

[Laura]

Having spent most of my life in the 303, I was super-happy to hear the posse is going to Boulder. If everything goes up in smoke and they get turned into zombies, at least they can enjoy the gorgeous scenery! That being said, I dislike Pegs and Datu enough that I'm pretty happy to see them leaving. I am also in favor of dropping them entirely from the story except for the occasional update.

Drama isn't usually as fun and enjoyable as it was in this episode! Pegs is a pain in the ass and the way she treated Michael just confirmed it. I think she's been playing with him the whole time. I listen to this podcast for a good story, and her obnoxious attention-seeking distracted me from other things going on. I've got a good feeling that Riley will kick some ass as a soldier, but I don't think she's just staying out of loyalty to Michael. She wants to stay in California because ANGEL is in California (yeah, I'm hoping he's still among the living).

KC really delivered on this episode!

[Osiris]

In Inglewood.

Dang it, Nik beat me to it!

It's ok, man.

[KillerOwl]

SO ... needless to say i couldnt wait for this one ... and now the next one ... MAN split up again :/ sigh idk what's to come of this ... but i know i'm ready to hear about burt angel and lizzy

[Osiris]

SO ... needless to say i couldnt wait for this one ... and now the next one ... MAN split up again :/ sigh idk what's to come of this ... but i know i'm ready to hear about burt angel and lizzy

Hey! Welcome! Shoot on over to the The Introductions Thread (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?14-Introduce-Yourself%21) and tell us a bit about yourself! I totallyy agree with you though, let's get to Burt, Angel and Scratch!

[Witch_Doctor]

As for the Colony taking over Irwin....I really don't see it. Think of it this way: Irwin is way too far away for the Colony who seems pretty content to stay within their safe confines. Not to mention Kimmet already gave us a way to create the conflict with the Colony/Mallers: They are trying to retake ground. If Irwin tries to retake LA that seems a far more likely scenario to bring these folks together for a good ol' fashioned feudin'.This keeps Irwin safe, and we still have the conflict we're clamoring for!

Chapter 19 3/3 12:28 Victor says,"Take every bit of the ammo. Don't leave anything behind. We can't take all of the guns but this'll slow them down." Pegs says, "But that won't leave them with anything." Kelly says, " I don't feel too bad for them."
This could be from only one of many weapons depots but it looks as if the colony would be shooting blanks.

[xV1per7x]

wow this episode was sad....

Datu and Pegs are gone.... :(

michael is sad, im sad...what the hell??

btw, im curious. now that the story is kind of split, which story interest you the most?

Michael and Riley's? or Saul and Victor's? this is hard because im also split between the two.

this podcast just get better and better :D

edit: also im sure their story will cross path again (and perhaps merge together?) but for now...it is split ;P

[Pandora]

I see you like to read!! Cool! Have you read Kings of the Dead? That one is not bad. I cant wait for next J.L. Bourne book! Whats your fav?

[Pandora]

The roads are blocked too. I am curious about Co. I bet it isnt all they have made it out to be. I can totally see Pegs crying 'What was I thinking! And I was so mean to Michael...why did we stop following HIS orders?' We shall see!

[Matt Gossett]

Going off of charecter roles that people have mentioned in the past, Hope still hasn't fulfiled any purpose yet, besides being "hopeless". (sorry) I don't think this is the last we've heard of this group. My biggest question is, when is Michael going to tell the Col about Paul/Ink/Pimp-Ass Zombie, and the other types of zombies, and how is he going to react?

[Witch_Doctor]

Bravo!!
Bravo!!
Don't know about the rest of y'all but this episode moved me emotionally. I was walking my dog while listening to it and confused the poor girl when I started sobbing like Datu and calling her Lady.
About the story
The type of post-apocalytic story changes at Fort Irwin. We've seen and read stories of doomsday focused on a local and personal level with the characters struggling for survival and rescue. They are cut off from the rest of the world, not knowing if anyone else is out there, if there is a safe haven, should they wait for help or venture from their fragile sanctuary in hopes of finding somewhere safer or a more secure form of normalcy. Think of the 'Night of the Living Dead' or '28 Days Later'. Then we have the stories were the characters have a wider view of their situation. They have a better idea of how much the world itself in threatened. Their numbers are greater and they are better equipted for survival and fighting back. "Battlestar Galactica", "Independance Day"...

We have moved from one story to another. Traditionally, the 'small lonely group' story ends with a fairytale-ish they lived happily ever after scene of arriving at a safe haven or walking off into the sunset with the smoldering carcass of a monster behind them. We never learn what happens in happily ever after land unless the monster's carcass twitches (hinting to a sequel).
I was surprised at how much I (and Michael) was disturbed after finally learning the scope of the devistation. It's one thing to suspect that the world has just ended and quite another to learn that it really has. Michael fights to survive in a hostile city, finding safety in an area no larger than a city block. He reaches safety in a santuary the size of a city only to learn that the whole outside world is dangerous.

About Michael's reaction

Michael finally has his meltdown. There are a number of comments on the forums critical of Michael's surprise that he might be pressed back into service once reaching Fort Irwin. This is not a fair critique coming from an audience capable of witnessing this story with the luxury of reason detatched from any personal peril experienced by the charaters. KC has done a wonderful job of writing these characters with multidimensional personalities. Just like real people, when under stress, common sense doesn't always stay at top of one's focus. Since the outbreak Michael had to:

Protect himself and his soldiers
Find safety
Find survivors
Find supplies
Fight adversaries
Find safer place

The drive to achieve each of those tasks, such as finding a safer place, can be so great that very little thought is put into 'What do I do when I get there?'
I knew he wouldn't find it easy to let his friends go. My first thoughts were how could he be so self centered to ask the others to enlist just to stay with him. In any other war families are separated from the soldiers. This would be no different. Then, I thought, 'The nerve of these guys! That's some grattutide! He saves their butts and they're acting like Han Solo loading boxes of Rebel money onto the Millinium Falcon after dropping off the Princess.' But, can they be faulted? Since the beginning, they were looking for safety and rescue. Sure, they fought and even turned into decent guerillas to stay alive. But, they did it with the goal in mind of survival, not to save the world. Michael, understandably, sees them as capable soldiers and commrades.

The Source

I've said it once and I'll say it again. The hows and whys might be revealed later, but the outbreak has some sort of geological origin. Can't say that it is exclusively fault lines, hot spots, volcanos or Digg Dugs http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/a0/Digdug.png but each of the places mentioned by the Colonel just ain't the most stable places in the world. Even the places such as Houston, Chicago and NY have geological.... stuff going on (Thanks RedShirt). This doesn't mean that the ground must be shaking and breaking Cecil B DeMille-Moses-dropping-the-10-Commandment-style. Just that there is some yet to be revealed connection. Again, there is something about Hawaii's Volcanos that made them 'nastier, meaner' than the one's in L.A.

OK g'night

[Witch_Doctor]

I cant wait for next J.L. Bourne book! Whats your fav?

I just finished listening to the audio versions of "Day by Day" and "Beyond Exile". I have mixed impressions but the stories might have been better if I read them instead. The narrator is horrible. The end of B.E. has me excited for the next book. It seemed to have picked of in excitement near the end of that book.

[Litmaster]

Hey! Welcome! Shoot on over to the The Introductions Thread (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?14-Introduce-Yourself%21) and tell us a bit about yourself! I totallyy agree with you though, let's get to Burt, Angel and Scratch!

My bet is that the next Maller scene will be with Scratch taking a pair of hot tongs to Angel's testicles....

[Osiris]

My bet is that the next Maller scene will be with Scratch taking a pair of hot tongs to Angel's testicles....

Ouch.

[nikvoodoo]

Going off of charecter roles that people have mentioned in the past, Hope still hasn't fulfiled any purpose yet, besides being "hopeless". (sorry) I don't think this is the last we've heard of this group. My biggest question is, when is Michael going to tell the Col about Paul/Ink/Pimp-Ass Zombie, and the other types of zombies, and how is he going to react?

Damnit....I knew there was something I forgot to mention. New thread comin'!

[Pandora]

Going off of charecter roles that people have mentioned in the past, Hope still hasn't fulfiled any purpose yet, besides being "hopeless". (sorry) I don't think this is the last we've heard of this group. My biggest question is, when is Michael going to tell the Col about Paul/Ink/Pimp-Ass Zombie, and the other types of zombies, and how is he going to react?


I know@ I was thinking the SAME thing! But reading your reply it hit me... they want to go back with some force maybe? Cant go scaring them off if that is what Michael has planned.

[VEE]

Going off of charecter roles that people have mentioned in the past, Hope still hasn't fulfiled any purpose yet, besides being "hopeless".

I think she is the cure, or at least what stops people turning. Perhaps Tanya discovered this.

She is, after all, called Hope.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Going off of charecter roles that people have mentioned in the past, Hope still hasn't fulfiled any purpose yet, besides being "hopeless". (sorry) I don't think this is the last we've heard of this group. My biggest question is, when is Michael going to tell the Col about Paul/Ink/Pimp-Ass Zombie, and the other types of zombies, and how is he going to react?

I'm not sure that a character has to have a purpose. Hope could simply be just another survivor. Her purpose could be to see to it that Datu has some happiness seeing as how we might never know if he'll reach his family in the Philippines. Though the fact that she could regain her sight makes me think perhaps you are right. They made a very good point of not telling Hope about Kalani's role as a spy and who knows what evidence her sight might bring into light.

As for Michael telling them about Pinstripes, I'm very curious too. I'm actually hoping that Saul and Victor complete their mission of retrieving Lizzy (and hopefully Burt and Angel too) so they can get reunited with Michael and the Ft. Irwin group. This house divided shit is pissing me off. The Colony, Mallers, and all other survivors should quit feuding over an ant hill and reclaim the fucking world!

[VEE]

Hope's purpose is to save the world, mark my words!

[reaper239]

I'm not sure that a character has to have a purpose. Hope could simply be just another survivor. Her purpose could be to see to it that Datu has some happiness seeing as how we might never know if he'll reach his family in the Philippines. Though the fact that she could regain her sight makes me think perhaps you are right. They made a very good point of not telling Hope about Kalani's role as a spy and who knows what evidence her sight might bring into light.

As for Michael telling them about Pinstripes, I'm very curious too. I'm actually hoping that Saul and Victor complete their mission of retrieving Lizzy (and hopefully Burt and Angel too) so they can get reunited with Michael and the Ft. Irwin group. This house divided shit is pissing me off. The Colony, Mallers, and all other survivors should quit feuding over an ant hill and reclaim the fucking world!

no way man, the dynamic here is freaking brilliant. we just lost, what, 4-5 people? at least for a little bit. so now we have a giant gaping hole in our character types, those have to be filled somewhere and i think we will find new characters approaching the CVS team (Chinwe, Victor, Saul). i can't wait, kc is great at writing deep real characters, so it will be interesting.

[nikvoodoo]

Reaper could be right. When I think of the show now, I feel a hole in my chest with the potential departures.

If the Boulder people truly are heading to CO and aren't the ones we see in sillhouette in the chapter art, I'm looking forward to filling that void with new characters: Kimmet, Puck, Carl, CJ and delving further into Michael, Victor and Saul.

And if need be that Angel dude. But I've gotten over my momentary lapse of judgement from yesterday ;)

EDIT: By the way......how....how do they (Nurse Britt and other Irwin medical staff) go over 24 hours....giving her a physical and then finally notice the bite mark? I....I.....really??? It's not like the mark was hidden on her ass or something. It's on her forearm, isn't it?

[reaper239]

Reaper could be right. When I think of the show now, I feel a hole in my chest with the potential departures.

If the Boulder people truly are heading to CO and aren't the ones we see in sillhouette in the chapter art, I'm looking forward to filling that void with new characters: Kimmet, Puck, Carl, CJ and delving further into Michael, Victor and Saul.

And if need be that Angel dude. But I've gotten over my momentary lapse of judgement from yesterday ;)

EDIT: By the way......how....how do they (Nurse Britt and other Irwin medical staff) go over 24 hours....giving her a physical and then finally notice the bite mark? I....I.....really??? It's not like the mark was hidden on her ass or something. It's on her forearm, isn't it?

maybe that was just an arm cut and the bite really was on her ass.

[Raven]

EDIT: By the way......how....how do they (Nurse Britt and other Irwin medical staff) go over 24 hours....giving her a physical and then finally notice the bite mark? I....I.....really??? It's not like the mark was hidden on her ass or something. It's on her forearm, isn't it?

THANK YOU!! I didn't get a chance to post it but seriously after the woman had a meltdown needed to be drugged and "You don't understand.....*THUD* You would think some warning bells would go off. Me thinks Nurse Britt was just to wrapped up in her own cameo :P

[VEE]

I'm starting to think that this Nurse Britt might not be a real nurse at all.

[nikvoodoo]

maybe that was just an arm cut and the bite really was on her ass.

If this be the case, I now question how exactly Tanya came to possess a zombie bite upon her backside.

[Raven]

If this be the case, I now question how exactly Tanya came to possess a zombie bite upon her backside.
Considering how quick she is with a quip? She probably invited the patient to do it ...and they did

[Nitara]

I'm not sure that a character has to have a purpose. Hope could simply be just another survivor. Her purpose could be to see to it that Datu has some happiness seeing as how we might never know if he'll reach his family in the Philippines. Though the fact that she could regain her sight makes me think perhaps you are right. They made a very good point of not telling Hope about Kalani's role as a spy and who knows what evidence her sight might bring into light.

As for Michael telling them about Pinstripes, I'm very curious too. I'm actually hoping that Saul and Victor complete their mission of retrieving Lizzy (and hopefully Burt and Angel too) so they can get reunited with Michael and the Ft. Irwin group. This house divided shit is pissing me off. The Colony, Mallers, and all other survivors should quit feuding over an ant hill and reclaim the fucking world!

I wouldn't count on that happening any time soon. People like Durai, Scratch, and Gatekeeper are in a position of power that they never would have achieved if not for the outbreak. They're not going to give that up easily.

[Pandora]

I don't trust Kimmet. Something about him..his voice? Maybe it is just his acting (I doubt it tho...KC wouldnt let that fly)? He just seems really 'non' if you know what I mean, I really didnt like hearing him speak... Not sure what it is but I KNOW the shit is about to hit the proverbial fan. The women in CO...are going to be forced into re-populating the world or to 'serve the men' or something bad (Kelly will be happy...LAWL) but when he said Michael can spend his $ on whatever you like, I think it is going to be pretty bad and not all happy times...No dancing around with tomatoe plants and wrenches, singing lovely songs about fixing sinks and dirty knees (prolly be crying about the dirty knees!! hahah. Pegs was so ubber hateful that has GOT to come back and bite her in the ass (cant wait!). SOO messed up to leave Michael all by himself...and he would have been if not for Riley, mega points for Riley...she just went up 10x more in my book!!

That Jolly Green Giant in LAX was a semi-failed escape mission..betcha $5. There is an idea!! Lets all make bets on our predictions!! All the money could go to 'Were Alive'!!! Gambling fundraiser..lol.

I dont know about Hope...She is just so weak. They prolly said they could fix her eyes cause 'young girls' are good for their evil doings, that could be BS just to separate them from Michael and get them to WANT to go to CO. What kind of roll are you guys thinking? I cant even imagine what she could do to 'save the world', other than being able to see a little and seeing something they didnt think she could see. I think Tanya is going to save the world with her 'vaccine' or whatever concoction she has come up with...and I think she has given it to everybody she has ever treated medically (well..in this group). Michael being reinstated is going to be very bad news....cant wait!!!

[zombie19]

How is it that no one else has seen or dealt with the other kinds of zombies?

Now that both towers are gone and the mailers blew up the arena, the horde may move towards Fort Irwin. Maybe C. Kimmet will send out a scavenger party close to L.A. and they will get tailed back by a smart one.

I know that base is well equipped, but I don't know if they could survive a wave. Especially with the fast, jumper, smart and mammoth zombie types. Same goes for the colony.

What does Tanya's zombie bite mean for everyone?

Well, I think Puck will be locked up for observation.
Pegs, Datu and Kelly will be kicked off the plane at gun point. This will happen somewhere in the beginning of 29-3. In the cover art, you can see the plane taking off and the three figures to the right.

Mike and his crew will be all reevaluated and will have extra tests performed. Michael will finally get his arm x-rayed.

With all this happening, I thinks we will hear from tower CVS or from the mallers. This will lead us into chapter 30, which will fill us in with everything else that is going on in L.A.. I hope so. I don't want to be stuck at the base this whole time.

p.s. I ran in the "Run for your Lives," race in MA over the weekend. It was a blast! Unfortunately, I didn't survive. :mad: I will try again next year and will need that shirt posted on the forum, "Better Start Running." The race is coming to California in October.

[Big G]

I think that Riley stayed because she is hoping that they might send her on a mission to L.A and she might come across Angel and Lizzy. I also think that if Saul and Tonya are immune to being turned or the haze from ground zero, it might not be because there is something special about their family but it might be because they are African-American.My reason for this is because in my listening of the podcast I don't think they have come any African-American zombies to my knowledge. If I am wrong please let me know.

[Miss]

I think I need to listen to it again I seem to have missed the whole Tanya being bitten being revealed. I was on public transportation whille listening to the last couple of episodes and there was a huge fight, I must have missed some explanation

[Merlin1274]

I see some skirmishes with the Mallers. But eventually I think by end of this story They will be wiped out.
The Colony is no threat. They do not want to leave their walls.. I still think the Mallers will try and make problems for Fort Irwin once they figure out they went there.
But I seen a raid on the mallers and then they will recover Burt, Angel and Lizzy before they end up with Saul and Victor making their way to Fort Irwin. Still a big story to uncover with those too.

[Osiris]

I think I need to listen to it again I seem to have missed the whole Tanya being bitten being revealed. I was on public transportation whille listening to the last couple of episodes and there was a huge fight, I must have missed some explanation

It happens right at the end of the episode. There's no real explanation.

[Pandora]

I think she is the cure, or at least what stops people turning. Perhaps Tanya discovered this.

She is, after all, called Hope.


Tonya didnt name her tho. Her name was hope before any of this happened.

[Osiris]

Hope is NOT the answer. Kc wouldn't possibly be that heavy-handed.

Besides, she filled her name-derived obligations already and saved Datu's life, giving him 'hope'.

[Pandora]

Oh yeah..I guess that would be her reason for staying...but not sure that she even really had a motive other than stickin with Michael...The story hasnt really identified very many peoples race. The people in the story yes but as far as zombies I dont think they have described them in that much depth.

As far as CO...It is either 'serving the men' or 'meat' there is not any fresh meat other than what hunters can round up...I would LOVE for KC to tie in some cannibals!! He is so super good...I bet it would be the best cannibal situation I have ever encountered!! CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS!!! uhm yea I guess I am a little sicko..but did I mention how cool cannibals would be? And dont even get me started on cannibals

[Osiris]

Oh yeah..I guess that would be her reason for staying...but not sure that she even really had a motive other than stickin with Michael...The story hasnt really identified very many peoples race. The people in the story yes but as far as zombies I dont think they have described them in that much depth.

As far as CO...It is either 'serving the men' or 'meat' there is not any fresh meat other than what hunters can round up...I would LOVE for KC to tie in some cannibals!! He is so super good...I bet it would be the best cannibal situation I have ever encountered!! CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS!!! uhm yea I guess I am a little sicko..but did I mention how cool cannibals would be? And dont even get me started on cannibals

:hsugh:

[reaper239]

Oh yeah..I guess that would be her reason for staying...but not sure that she even really had a motive other than stickin with Michael...The story hasnt really identified very many peoples race. The people in the story yes but as far as zombies I dont think they have described them in that much depth.

As far as CO...It is either 'serving the men' or 'meat' there is not any fresh meat other than what hunters can round up...I would LOVE for KC to tie in some cannibals!! He is so super good...I bet it would be the best cannibal situation I have ever encountered!! CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS...CANNIBALS!!! uhm yea I guess I am a little sicko..but did I mention how cool cannibals would be? And dont even get me started on cannibals

isn't that what the survivors are running from?

[Adventureless_Hero]

no way man, the dynamic here is freaking brilliant. we just lost, what, 4-5 people? at least for a little bit. so now we have a giant gaping hole in our character types, those have to be filled somewhere and i think we will find new characters approaching the CVS team (Chinwe, Victor, Saul). i can't wait, kc is great at writing deep real characters, so it will be interesting.

True. It makes for good story, but I was more concerned with how shitty it is this situation occurred in the first place. You would think human-kind would band together to stomp out the greater evil, but greed takes hold and everyone just wants to protect theirs. Bastardos!

[reaper239]

True. It makes for good story, but I was more concerned with how shitty it is this situation occurred in the first place. You would think human-kind would band together to stomp out the greater evil, but greed takes hold and everyone just wants to protect theirs. Bastardos!

ah, well yes, i will say that the civillian outpost in boulder doesn't make a lot of sense to me either. i mean, do you really think that you would be safe there? hell no, i would want to be where the most guns and ammo were as well as the most experienced warriors.

[Adventureless_Hero]

ah, well yes, i will say that the civillian outpost in boulder doesn't make a lot of sense to me either. i mean, do you really think that you would be safe there? hell no, i would want to be where the most guns and ammo were as well as the most experienced warriors.

I don't know much about the city, but just for the fact that it has a ton of civilians, yes, I agree with you. 150,000 means nothing when all it takes is one to turn those numbers against you. That's potentially 150,000 new zombies.

I don't think they should put all their eggs in one basket, but rather have large groups here and there. They need multiple colonies, eliminating the threat where ever they encounter it. Instead of rescue missions, they should be on search and destroy mode. But the damned disputes between different human factions make me almost want the zombies to take over.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

Come on now.. you guys really don't think that Boulder isn't fortified? It'll be a f'n impossible place to invade by now.
I like how KC totally dicked over the Air Force this episode. LOL.. all the branches got some action but us, then he shows a C-130 transport plane. hahahahah. That tickled me

Love how Mike got wrangled back into service. WTF did he think was gonna happen? You're in the reserves, you get called in via recall. You have a CAC and on active duty base... guess what? Sorry, i'm losing focus here. Back to "reality".

Some people have asked about Navy ships and what would happen to them? Well, they'd stay at sea. You have entire battle groups out to sea at one time. That's thousands and thousands of people out there from the middle east, the Pacific, the Atlantic and the Med. That's OUR Navy alone. Enough ordinace on one battleship is enough to level a midwestern town quicker than an F4.
Cruise ships will be safe as long as they were out during the start.

Missle crews (fire team of 8 Security Force members, 4 cooks, and 4 officers in the actual missle launch facility) at all the Northern Tier bases. Montana, Wyoming, N/S Dakota. Malstom, F.E Warren, and Minot all still have over 500 ICBMs. That's a ton of troops supporting those launch facilities that will be alive and with limited comm. You may ask "how would they be alive?"
simply due to the remote locations. Some of which you can only reach via helo. They're self sustaining units. The only thing is you only have the ammo you have on you...180 rounds. One heavy gunner and one grenadier.

Back to the Navy.. I forgot about the Subs.

[IamPaul]

A great episode. I feel that we will not see the Boulder crew until mid to late season 4. Maybe Pegs studies to be a doctor and comes back to Irwin. I was really hoping Michael would yell "I Love You!" to Pegs before the plane took off. This is the first episode in a while that I was about to shed some tears. I was choked up. I think the last time was Season 2 finale, but correct if I am wrong about something in this Season. I am beginning to wonder if the Michael crew will ever meet up with Saul, Victor, Burt and Angel again. Seems like it will be hard, unless the LA crew goes to Irwin.

[reaper239]

no, i think one big colony is the best way to set up the defense, my point was, one big colony, that way all your forces are in one place. yes boulder would be fortified at this point would be extra fortified at this point, but it sound like they have barely enough troops to man the wall there. idk, maybe i'm missing something, but 150k, in my mind, they should be trained and then defend themselves so the soldiers can focus on retaking the continental US.

[Litmaster]

If this be the case, I now question how exactly Tanya came to possess a zombie bite upon her backside.


Considering how quick she is with a quip? She probably invited the patient to do it ...and they did


Tanya "did it".... with a zombie ?!?? (SSHHHHUDDER...)


Oh, God, I think..... I think we're delving into (QUEASE!)... into and area where... where we dont' want to go and..


(RRRRRETCH!!)

(HEEAVE!) Oh God, I think I'm gonna...

BRAAAAAAAWWLPH!!!

RAAAAAAAALPH!!!!

BLEEEEEEEEAAAAWW!!!


*gasp*, uh, I just had a visual of Tanya, just--

BRAAAAAAAWLCHHHH!

REEEEETCH!




Oh, the horror!

The Horror!!!

[Nitara]

I understand everyone's concerns about taking all the survivors to Bolder. But if they had multiple colonies, wouldn't they still be facing the same problems? If you have more colonies to protect, then you need to use more soldiers to protect civilians. After all, no area is completely safe from zombies. And if you have so many soldiers protecting the colonies, how many would be left to gather information, rescue survivors, or destroy zombies. Plus, you'd have multiple planes flying to different locations, which means more fuel will be wasted. So to me, it makes sense for them to stay in one place until the zombie threat is dealt with.

[Adventureless_Hero]

I understand everyone's concerns about taking all the survivors to Bolder. But if they had multiple colonies, wouldn't they still be facing the same problems? If you have more colonies to protect, then you need to use more soldiers to protect civilians. After all, no area is completely safe from zombies. And if you have so many soldiers protecting the colonies, how many would be left to gather information, rescue survivors, or destroy zombies. Plus, you'd have multiple planes flying to different locations, which means more fuel will be wasted. So to me, it makes sense for them to stay in one place until the zombie threat is dealt with.

Dealth with by whom? They are the ones who are going to have to deal with it. I do believe it's good to have a fall back zone or but I worry that a place as big as Boulder could be dangerous. Like Reaper said, it doesn't sound like they have a lot of troops protecting the place. With that many heads, it seems as though an outbreak within the community at Boulder could be devastating.

Though there could be quite a few places safe from zombies in the world, like Antarctica, The Himalayas, etc. Remote places where travel on foot is damn near impossible, even if you are a tough as nails zombie.

I think multiple colonies in L.A. could have worked, if they just WORKED TOGETHER. If the Mallers and the Colony and Michael's Tower and CJ's tower all focused their efforts on killing zombies and helping keep each other alive, it doesn't seem like it would have been that tough to clean out L.A. Hell, the Mallers were doing a pretty damn good job on their own.

[Litmaster]

Missle crews (fire team of 8 Security Force members, 4 cooks, and 4 officers in the actual missle launch facility) at all the Northern Tier bases. Montana, Wyoming, N/S Dakota. Malstom, F.E Warren, and Minot all still have over 500 ICBMs. That's a ton of troops supporting those launch facilities that will be alive and with limited comm. You may ask "how would they be alive?"
simply due to the remote locations. Some of which you can only reach via helo. They're self sustaining units. The only thing is you only have the ammo you have on you...180 rounds. One heavy gunner and one grenadier.

That's a ton of troops, but the sites themselves are not built for defense, they are built to respond to remote security threats to silos. The only thing they have for defense is a chain link fence and a bunch of farmer's fields all around. I used to work in the missile field at Grand Forks AFB before they shut down their silos, so I've been out on those sites on duty. The only 'safe' guys would be the two officers on duty down in the capsule, and they would surely starve to death before too long.

[not_infected]

Poor Michael. Even though he can be quite annoying, I really feel for him. His method of coping with loss is to distance himself. He doesn't deal with emotions, he doesn't allow himself to get close to people. Finally, he says to himself -- For God's sake, it's the end of the world. I might as well get close to another human. BAM. Sorry, guy.

Pegs, I've always disliked you.

I am totally on the Tanya vaccine/antivenom bandwagon, and I believe she started experimenting back in the Colony.

Riley, rock on.

Kelly, from such meager beginnings. I will miss you, hope you won't be gone forever.

Catch you later Datu, Hope.

And I agree with those who think there's something really off about Kimmet. Bad news, that guy.

[Cabbage Patch]

That's a ton of troops, but the sites themselves are not built for defense, they are built to respond to remote security threats to silos. The only thing they have for defense is a chain link fence and a bunch of farmer's fields all around. I used to work in the missile field at Grand Forks AFB before they shut down their silos, so I've been out on those sites on duty. The only 'safe' guys would be the two officers on duty down in the capsule, and they would surely starve to death before too long.

What type of comms do the personnel at these remote sites have? Is there any way they could make their presence known to a base like Fort Irwin? In my mind I'm picturing a survivor sitting at an Autovon phone, dialing number after number from a government phone directory hoping someone will pick up.

*for Non-Vets, "Autovon phone" refers to the government's secure telephone network, which was designed to survive a nuclear exchange. The official name changed to something else in the 80s, but we kept on calling them Autovon where I was stationed. The phones can be used to call any other phone on the network, worldwide, but only have a limited ability to connect to the civilian phone system.

[Bray]

After quickly skim reading it seems I'm the only one who thinks what I think.

Boulder doesn't exist.

It was something Puck said last episode. (think it was Puck anyways) he said if the outbreak happened a week later there would have been a battalion of infantry on the base. But he then muttered 'more mouths to feed' if you had a secure population centre of 150k that from what Carl was saying to the guys seems to be secure and pumping out food surely the extra trained soldiers would have been more than welcome?

Therefore, I think, probably incorrectly, that boulder doesn't exist, all survivors are given a choice, join up and fight, or go to boulder that doesn't exist and they are probably just left in a field to be eaten. After all if all your population are soldiers you stand a much better chance of defeating the outbreak than having most of your forces defending civilians.

I never used to be so cynical, must be Kc's doing!

[cupcakezombie]

As a Pegs fan I just want to address some of the Pegs hating that has been going on in this thread. :)
Whether or not you agree with her decision, I am sure a lot of you would be able to think of someone who might not be able to pick up a gun in a similar situation. In fact, you might be able to think of people who would have fallen to pieces completely and provided no help at all.
She has stuck to her ideals throughout the course of the show, and as a character grew a lot from where she was when she first appeared. She has become a really confident character, and contributed in many ways to the group. I love Pegs because she is positive and helped Michael to see (even for a little while) what he is really fighting for; friendship, love and humanity.
Also, her saying that she isn't suited to staying in the army, is better then just staying to be near to Michael and not being able to do everything that would be expected of her in a dire situation. Her leaving Michael, whom she really does have deep feelings for, took a lot of courage in the face of the pressure that he was putting on her. For me her coldness was not her suddenly hating Michael but her showing the strength of her convictions and is something to be admired. If someone that you loved asked you to do something that goes against what you believe or are capable of, what would you do. Her not crying and running away reflects how much she has grown.
Rant over.
cupcake out <3

[Osiris]

Doesn't matter, still hate Pegs.

[cupcakezombie]

Doesn't matter, still hate Pegs.

That is ok, don't think I will change anyone's thoughts on her, but wanted to show that she is not as shallow as everyone seems to think she is. A lot of people (not you because you did show her support earlier in the thread even though you don't like her :) ) seem to be throwing all the flak her way, for Michael and her breaking-up, because people don't like her, but it is not all her fault.
Not everyone has to like her, just maybe a little respect for dealing as well as she can in the new world. :)

[Osiris]

That is ok, don't think I will change anyone's thoughts on her, but wanted to show that she is not as shallow as everyone seems to think she is. A lot of people (not you because you did show her support earlier in the thread even though you don't like her :) ) seem to be throwing all the flak her way, for Michael and her breaking-up, because people don't like her, but it is not all her fault.
Not everyone has to like her, just maybe a little respect for dealing as well as she can in the new world. :)

Don't get me wrong. I've hated her since the beginning. She's just annoyed me at every utterance, that and she brought the full wrath of Scratch down upon the heads of the Residents. Not to mention, the whole flower pot fiasco. For me, she's always been a voice I could do without. The whole 'woe is me' thing grates on my nerves. Her standing up in the end and telling Mikey "No" was probably the best choice she could have made. It at least proved she had some semblance of a spine. I applaud that act, with total and complete sincerity.

In the end, it matters little. Let's hug it out.

[Cabbage Patch]

That is ok, don't think I will change anyone's thoughts on her, but wanted to show that she is not as shallow as everyone seems to think she is. A lot of people (not you because you did show her support earlier in the thread even though you don't like her :) ) seem to be throwing all the flak her way, for Michael and her breaking-up, because people don't like her, but it is not all her fault.
Not everyone has to like her, just maybe a little respect for dealing as well as she can in the new world. :)

Pegs deserves full credit for everything she's done in the story. She's a survivor, which is more than you can say for 99.9995% of pre-outbreak America. She pulled her weight at the Tower and stepped up magnificently at the end, learning to fly the helicopter and safely extracting the survivors from a battlefield to safety at Fort Irwin. I would have liked to see her stay at Fort Irwin, particularly if she would have out-ranked Michael, but it's hard to fault her for seeking something closer to normality. I have a feeling we'll be hearing from her again.

[VEE]

Hope is NOT the answer. Kc wouldn't possibly be that heavy-handed.

Besides, she filled her name-derived obligations already and saved Datu's life, giving him 'hope'.


Purloined letter

[Ra1th]

Well that is certainly one way to deal with exposition and still make it awesome, now ain't it?

Damn...just damn. If this is truly the last time we see Datu, Pegs, Kelly and Hope I'm gonna have a big sad. Either the story branches off to them too, or Burt and Angel come back soon because I don't know if I can handle it! Please note: This is the first time I'm begging to get those characters back....you know we've reached critical if I'm begging for an Angel return!


I'm sorry, I didn't quite hear you the first time. What's this about Angel?


Also I think Michael's plea for his friends to stay will be more justified if we don't see pegs, datu, hope and kelly anymore. Right now, we can think, oh how could he be so selfish, but say one of those characters were your favorite, and this was the end of their part in the WA story, sooner or later you'll start wishing they'd come back or that they'd never left.

I can totally see this being the end of the road for those characters just because their goal was to survive long enough to find permanent safety and shelter and be rescued, and here it is. They have everything they need. Their character arcs have started, and finished. Kelly started out as a bitch who didn't want to do anything and took everything for granted, and then she lost Tommy and we saw her get through that death and become a hardened survivor. Pegs started out as a meek flower girl who was always being pushed around and by the end of her story, she'd gotten stronger and could do what's necessary to survive, but at the same time she held on to her convictions and beliefs of only using violence when absolutely necessary. Datu was always useful, but he went through a terrible ordeal at the arena, and worked through the survivors guilt and the loss, and finally found hope in Hope.

These characters were great. There may have been times we disliked them, but they developed and matured into deep characters but their fight is now over. If this is the beginning of the second act, then what lies ahead is combat, and action. The scattered groups need to complete their story arcs. Vic, Saul and CJ need to finish their ground zero experiments. We need to start the Lizzy, Burt, :yay:ANGEL:D story line. And continue Michael and Puck's military story. And at some point they need to meet up and join forces and there'll probably be some major conflict to end the season.

So yeah, it'd be cool if we could not see Pegs, Kelly and Datu for a very long time so we as an audience feel the weight of that decision to fly away to colorado, and leave the frontlines.

[Ra1th]

i
A great episode. I feel that we will not see the Boulder crew until mid to late season 4. Maybe Pegs studies to be a doctor and comes back to Irwin. I was really hoping Michael would yell "I Love You!" to Pegs before the plane took off. This is the first episode in a while that I was about to shed some tears. I was choked up. I think the last time was Season 2 finale, but correct if I am wrong about something in this Season. I am beginning to wonder if the Michael crew will ever meet up with Saul, Victor, Burt and Angel again. Seems like it will be hard, unless the LA crew goes to Irwin.

I'm of the impression that Irwin will send people to LA. Michael is intel. He'd be the perfect guy to send in to check out the source of the outbreak. And from there, you could see conflicts arise between the mallers and if the colony is moving in on LA or not. or whatever might happen.

[Osiris]

Ra1th just came to be a jerk.

[GeneTwo]

I agree with Ra1th, I think this is the turning point from just surviving to fighting back.

[Pandora]

After quickly skim reading it seems I'm the only one who thinks what I think.

Boulder doesn't exist.

It was something Puck said last episode. (think it was Puck anyways) he said if the outbreak happened a week later there would have been a battalion of infantry on the base. But he then muttered 'more mouths to feed' if you had a secure population centre of 150k that from what Carl was saying to the guys seems to be secure and pumping out food surely the extra trained soldiers would have been more than welcome?

Therefore, I think, probably incorrectly, that boulder doesn't exist, all survivors are given a choice, join up and fight, or go to boulder that doesn't exist and they are probably just left in a field to be eaten. After all if all your population are soldiers you stand a much better chance of defeating the outbreak than having most of your forces defending civilians.

I never used to be so cynical, must be Kc's doing!

OH...I like that! I dont like nor trust Kimmet...he is full of somethin. I was thinking the Boulder wonderland existed, But that it was going to be a hell hole, for meat or 'service to the men population' I had wrote that I thought the Jolly Green Giant was an escape mission...but dayum...i think you are right...their family or something was dumped and they were trying to get to rescue them and make their way without Irwin people! His line of 'there is too much hesitation when the enemy is your friend or neighbor' makes a little more sense if it is meant that they cant do what 'needs' to be done! That also explains their reaction to the returned helicopter...ALL they had to say about it was 'yeah..we figured thats what happened' when Michael says they were over run. I felt like..WTH..Why are dont you care where the people are...what happened to them??? Seemed like they couldnt have cared less, because they flat out didnt give a damn!

[Pandora]

Burt wouldnt have gobbled up Kimmet and Pucks bullshit story of their little wonderland!!

[reaper239]

O_oO_oO_oO_oO_oO_o

i think someone finally lost it on the forums...

[yarri]

O_oO_oO_oO_oO_oO_o

i think someone finally lost it on the forums...
And this is new how?

[Pandora]

And what is that supposed to mean..oh please do explain.

[yarri]

And what is that supposed to mean..oh please do explain.

I was enjoying your excellent enthusiasm about Burt.

[yarri]

I miss Burt.

[Adventureless_Hero]

I'm still wondering who that guy with the address to CJ's hidden orchard was. It seems this chapter might be focused only on Ft. Irwin though. And even if they get back to Victor, Saul, and CJ, I don't know if the question will come up.

[nikvoodoo]

Burt wouldnt have gobbled up Kimmet and Pucks bullshit story of their little wonderland!!

What about Carl? He came from Boulder and didn't have anything bad to say about it.

And maybe its just me....but nothing they really described sounds like a wonderland to me. It sounds more like Zion in the Matrix. Small city of humanity on the verge of constantly being wiped out by a superior opponent.

[yarri]

I'm still wondering who that guy with the address to CJ's hidden orchard was. It seems this chapter might be focused only on Ft. Irwin though. And even if they get back to Victor, Saul, and CJ, I don't know if the question will come up.

Cj plays her cards close to her chest could she had a spy in the Maller ranks?

[Pandora]

I dont think that is what Reaper meant..I found it rude and condescending. I was just happy that someone finally agreed with me that Boulder is going to be a giant clusterfuc..if there is even this Boulder. To say I have 'lost it' to me..means off their rocker...but this is the first forum that has ever interested me..so maybe I do not know the definition of 'lost it'...Maybe I am overly sensitive to it because I live with a crazy freakin narcissist for a husband. That is why I ask for Reaper to explain..yes please do explain, because that hurt my feelings...and I really dont need anymore of that shit in my life.

[yarri]

I dont think that is what Reaper meant..I found it rude and condescending. I was just happy that someone finally agreed with me that Boulder is going to be a giant clusterfuc..if there is even this Boulder. To say I have 'lost it' to me..means off their rocker...but this is the first forum that has ever interested me..so maybe I do not know the definition of 'lost it'...Maybe I am overly sensitive to it because I live with a crazy freakin narcissist for a husband. That is why I ask for Reaper to explain..yes please do explain, because that hurt my feelings...and I really dont need anymore of that shit in my life.

Oh crap I'm sorry I thought you were talkin to me. Losing it is pretty normal here and not a bad thing for this fan base is Powerfully Passionate about every topic, therory,character and crazy tin foil hat idea you could imagine. If you have passion for zombies this is your place. I'm sorry about your husband I can empathize. I know Reaper pretty well I don't speak for him but I do know he's a nice guy that would never intentionally harm a soul.

[Adventureless_Hero]

What about Carl? He came from Boulder and didn't have anything bad to say about it.

And maybe its just me....but nothing they really described sounds like a wonderland to me. It sounds more like Zion in the Matrix. Small city of humanity on the verge of constantly being wiped out by a superior opponent.

Virtual High five! When they mentioned Boulder I immediately thought of Zion from the Matrix! lol The world seems to be in bad shape if they can't get in contact with anyone. But I do believe there is plenty Kimmet is hiding from us all. I can't get NORAD out of my head, especially now that I know it is in Colorado Springs, very close to Boulder.

I see this and the previous few chapters as a turning point where they characters are going from merely surviving to taking a proactive stance. I think Ra1th may have said that earlier. But I totally agree. Michael should recieve orders to be flown back to L.A. to investigate Ground Zero and track down/kill Pinstripes!

[reaper239]

I dont think that is what Reaper meant..I found it rude and condescending. I was just happy that someone finally agreed with me that Boulder is going to be a giant clusterfuc..if there is even this Boulder. To say I have 'lost it' to me..means off their rocker...but this is the first forum that has ever interested me..so maybe I do not know the definition of 'lost it'...Maybe I am overly sensitive to it because I live with a crazy freakin narcissist for a husband. That is why I ask for Reaper to explain..yes please do explain, because that hurt my feelings...and I really dont need anymore of that shit in my life.

well then i apologize, let me clarify: i thought you were posting a tinfoil hat theory, and i replied in jest. i meant no offense by it, so let me reply seriously:

i agree with nik, i don't think boulder is a wonderland, but i definitely think it exists. i also agree with you that kimmet is full of something foul, but i don't think he's like that guy from 28 days later (the platoon leader or whatever). i apologize again, it was meant as a joke and not as a malicious comment.

[HardKor]

What about Carl? He came from Boulder and didn't have anything bad to say about it.

And maybe its just me....but nothing they really described sounds like a wonderland to me. It sounds more like Zion in the Matrix. Small city of humanity on the verge of constantly being wiped out by a superior opponent.

Complete agreement here. I kept thinking of a combination of "The Stand" (because Boulder just makes me think of that in any context) and World War Z.

[Nitara]

I'm still wondering who that guy with the address to CJ's hidden orchard was. It seems this chapter might be focused only on Ft. Irwin though. And even if they get back to Victor, Saul, and CJ, I don't know if the question will come up.

Could it be Skittles? After all, he was in CJ's tower, so it's possible that he knows about the orchard. If not, then it might be one of the mallers, or someone else we haven't seen yet.

[Cabbage Patch]

Could it be Skittles? After all, he was in CJ's tower, so it's possible that he knows about the orchard. If not, then it might be one of the mallers, or someone else we haven't seen yet.

I suspect that Skittles is still around and that he'll be important to the story again. But wouldn't that make for a sad, funny story. Skittles wakes up one morning feeling lucid and sane. He remembers the garden, so he jots down the location on a scrap of paper. Then he heads off to join his friends at the Tower only to realize, too late, that he's no longer invisible to the zombies!

An alternate theory. The zombie with the address could have been from Fort Irwin. Col Kimmet did say that there were "special ops" going on, and there was reference to a "squad going down". Maybe the zombie with the note was part of a recon of LA. Maybe there are survivors still there.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Could it be Skittles? After all, he was in CJ's tower, so it's possible that he knows about the orchard. If not, then it might be one of the mallers, or someone else we haven't seen yet.

I don't think it was Skittles simply for the fact that the address to the Orchard was obtained off a dead body. I'm thinking it was either a Maller who discovered the orchard, or possibly one of CJ's people who defected from her group.

[Kc]

I like how KC totally dicked over the Air Force this episode. LOL.. all the branches got some action but us, then he shows a C-130 transport plane. hahahahah. That tickled me

Of COURSE that wasn't an intentional slight at the Air Force. Just saying...

[Nitara]

I don't think it was Skittles simply for the fact that the address to the Orchard was obtained off a dead body. I'm thinking it was either a Maller who discovered the orchard, or possibly one of CJ's people who defected from her group.

I had completely forgotten about that. I'll need to listen to those episodes again. I just remembered CJ asking Victor and Saul if they were the people who had been stealing her fruit. I'm currently listening to the first two seasons, plus the episodes that are being released now. I guess I'm on WA overload. :)

[Adventureless_Hero]

On relistening to the departure scene in which the crew leaves Michael, I noticed that Datu gave Michael his journal. Now it seemed like it could be nothing, but do you suppose Datu may have an entry in his journal that could be of interest? Perhaps he had a conversation with Hope in which she said something that sounded mundane, but ended up being quite revealing? She could have had more info regarding the Colony, Shaun, and/or maybe even something interesting regarding Zombies.

[reaper239]

On relistening to the departure scene in which the crew leaves Michael, I noticed that Datu gave Michael his journal. Now it seemed like it could be nothing, but do you suppose Datu may have an entry in his journal that could be of interest? Perhaps he had a conversation with Hope in which she said something that sounded mundane, but ended up being quite revealing? She could have had more info regarding the Colony, Shaun, and/or maybe even something interesting regarding Zombies.

i think that explains any datu perspectives to this point. the story is told through journals, which means that bit with scratch at the tail of the season two finale was relayed into the story because one of the characters writing journals (meaning angel or burt) were still alive, and concious enough to hear and understand it. they already did a journal dump earlier, which tanya was transcribing to computer, so up to a point we already have everyones perspective pooled. now anything we learn beyond what michael experiences directly will come from journals given to michael at some point in the future (which means that the CVS crew will, at some point, rejoin michael. even if we operate under the assumption that everyone is dead and some survivor somewhere is learning about their experiences, in order for them to be read together by the same person they would have to be together before the writers died)

[Cabbage Patch]

Not to discourage anything, but "The Box" is just local lingo in Irwin for the Area to the north of the base that is used for training purposes. It's huge. Michael's reaction was my reaction. "Oh? I never heard it called that before", but all the locals do.

Want to see "The Box" for yourself? Fort Irwin conducts free tours, two days a month. Here's a link where you can find details: http://www.irwin.army.mil/Visitors/Pages/TheNTCBoxTours.aspx

BTW, there was an entire lexicon of local names for places and things at Fort Irwin that those of us in the permanent party used but did not share with the troops rotating in for training. We did this for security and safety reasons. All the training that happens at Fort Irwin is carefully coreographed and tightly controlled in order to maintain safety. But it is also designed to come as close to actual combat as you can get without actual killing, which means that the choreography has to be carefully hidden from the training units.

There are four different groups at Fort Irwin that control the battlefield, and they must maintain constant radio communication to "guide" the battle. The observer/controllers, or "OCs" are experienced personnel who accompany the training units everywhere, monitor their communications, read their orders and track their movements. The opposing forces, or "OPFOR", are Army units that play the enemy on the battlefield using foreign tactics and vehicles modified to look "different". The "Star Wars Building" is a high tech command center that can track every vehicle and soldier in The Box using GPS trackers and feed from hundreds of video cameras located throughout The Box, as well as recording all communications. The Operations Group, or "Ops Group", pulls everything together, controlling both the training unit (for whom it always plays the next higher military headquarters), the OCs, the OPFOR and the Star Wars Building.

If the mission plan calls for a unit to do something these four elements have to work together to make sure the training unit does exactly what was planned, without things seeming forced or pre-ordained. Sometimes that means sending down orders from "higher headquarters" to change the direction of movement, sometimes it means delaying an OPFOR attack because the training unit isn't in position yet, sometimes it means an OC has to redirect a training unit that is straying outside of their sector.

The problem with all of this is that everyone, training units, OCs, OPFOR, Star Wars Building and OPs Group, are using the same radios, and for safety reasons none of the communications can be encryptyed. It's impossible to prevent the training units from overhearing what the permanent party are saying around them. Hence the local code names for things. An OC can get on the radio and tell the OPFOR to hold at "the dry wash by the cutoff to the Rockpile" and expect that a training unit soldier who overhears the radio transmission will not understand the reference.

[trubkir]

The term "Down Squad" has been bothering me. I think squads are rotated one squad is on duty, one squad is training, and one squad is down meaning they have time off. I think that Col. Kimmet was just P.O'ed that the down squad probably got into some shenanigans with their down time. I don't think it means a squad that was on duty has been wiped out.

[Litmaster]

What type of comms do the personnel at these remote sites have? Is there any way they could make their presence known to a base like Fort Irwin? In my mind I'm picturing a survivor sitting at an Autovon phone, dialing number after number from a government phone directory hoping someone will pick up.

I believe it was Autovon at the time I was in, but they have since switched to a different system. I was at Grand Forks AFB in 1993-94, so they still had all the old Cold War shit back then. I was surprised to find out that they turned one of my old sites, Oscar Zero, into a museum!

Anyway, guarding nukes was a sucky job in a sucky part of the US (sorry, any of you from North Dakota, but your state sucks). Cold and flat, and nothin' to do. The only good part was our schedule was 3 days on, 6 days off. I found a 10 minute travel channel video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVv4gz2nd6U&feature=related) on YouTube that gives a pretty good overview of the old LCFs and even takes you into the silos themselves. The video was filmed at F.E. Warren, but that is pretty much the way things were at Grand Forks as well. I was only there for a year, but I have lots of funny stories about guys chasing rabbits off the LFs at 3 in the morning...


Of COURSE that wasn't an intentional slight at the Air Force. Just saying...

Translation of Kc's Real Meaning: "You Chair Force guys are all a bunch of pussies!" :D:D:D


Oh crap I'm sorry I thought you were talkin to me. Losing it is pretty normal here and not a bad thing for this fan base is Powerfully Passionate about every topic, therory,character and crazy tin foil hat idea you could imagine. If you have passion for zombies this is your place. I'm sorry about your husband I can empathize. I know Reaper pretty well I don't speak for him but I do know he's a nice guy that would never intentionally harm a soul.


well then i apologize, let me clarify: i thought you were posting a tinfoil hat theory, and i replied in jest. i meant no offense by it, so let me reply seriously:

Hey Reaper and Yarri... you guys are both great to apologize like that. I've done forums like this for awhile and know it is WAY TOO EASY to misinterpret the subtle meaning and tone of what someone writes, so people getting pissed at each other is rather common. Doesn't happen that much here though, I think, because we're mainly focused on talking about the story and not each other. So anyway...

...oh yeah. Uh, about the new episode. Hey, what happened to Lady?! Did they take the dog with them to Boulder???

[Adventureless_Hero]

...oh yeah. Uh, about the new episode. Hey, what happened to Lady?! Did they take the dog with them to Boulder???

Yup. It was a job entrusted to Hope, Dog-holder and seat-warmer.

[IamPaul]

i

I'm of the impression that Irwin will send people to LA. Michael is intel. He'd be the perfect guy to send in to check out the source of the outbreak. And from there, you could see conflicts arise between the mallers and if the colony is moving in on LA or not. or whatever might happen.

Very true. Michael probably has more knowledge of the situation than the army does. He knows about the arena, pimp ass zombie, and the fact that the 'zombies' somewhat follow orders. Also sending Michael to LA could be his way out of the army. But there would be no reasonable way for him to get to Boulder and to his one and only Pegs.

[dontkillburt]

Did anyone else think that Kimmet was lying when he said he knew nothing about the "cause of it?"

I certainly do. But for whatever reason, every time I relisten to this very informative conversation between Kimmet, Michael and Puck, I keep thinking back to the scene between General Jack Ripper and Group Capt. Lionel Mandrake from Dr. Strangeglove. "I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids."

I don't know why. I don't think that a zombie invasion (or fluoridation of our water supply) was a communist plot, and maybe it's just that Kimmet's tone and Sterling Hayden sound alike. I don't think he is telling Michael all, but since Michael has essentially been placed in a need to know position, alot should be coming to the light shortly.

I'm a little shocked that Puck didn't know, or couldn't figure out, that there were hot spots outside of the U.S. before everything went silent. What would have been the secrecy behind that?

[Bonnonon]

Is anyone else secretly hoping the plane gets to Boulder and the place is overrun? It would keep the group together and make the story interesting...

[Kc]

Translation of Kc's Real Meaning: "You Chair Force guys are all a bunch of pussies!" :D:D:D


No. I didn't mean that at all. Of course, they all finished behind the one army guy in my engineering course, but that was another time...
But seriously, mad props to the REAL Air Force and there was an Air force crew working the plane the group flew out on, so they are there too.

[Burroatomico]

I'm new to the blogging in general and I'm just getting my feet wet.
I think that they will find a cure or antidote and then use the ability that the zombie in the suit has to control the other zombies in the rebuilding of America and the world

[Adventureless_Hero]

No. I didn't mean that at all. Of course, they all finished behind the one army guy in my engineering course, but that was another time...
But seriously, mad props to the REAL Air Force and there was an Air force crew working the plane the group flew out on, so they are there too.

With that said, I am going to re-edit my submission to the Timeline that once read, "-all branches of military are working together (save Air Force which was not mentioned)" to now say "-all branches of military are working together"

[yarri]

Of COURSE that wasn't an intentional slight at the Air Force. Just saying...

:D my step daddy (whom I've placed on a very tall pedestal) and love deeply is a retired Chief Master Sergeant in the USAF after 30 years he's still the greatest combat baggage handler in the history of the world! Yeah! Air Power! (grins)

[Osiris]

Chair. That reminds me of something...

[Ra1th]

No. I didn't mean that at all. Of course, they all finished behind the one army guy in my engineering course, but that was another time...
But seriously, mad props to the REAL Air Force and there was an Air force crew working the plane the group flew out on, so they are there too.

Was it you?



I feel like the air force would be weakened most in this scenario. There's no real need for F35s and F22s, when zombies are your main enemies. A chopper could do the job using less fuel. Maybe UAVs? Cyberwarfare is no longer existant, and satellites... Wait shouldn't satellites still be operational?

[Litmaster]

Was it you?
I feel like the air force would be weakened most in this scenario. There's no real need for F35s and F22s, when zombies are your main enemies. A chopper could do the job using less fuel. Maybe UAVs? Cyberwarfare is no longer existant, and satellites... Wait shouldn't satellites still be operational?

I think the only USAF units that would be extremely valuable in this zombie-scenario would be Pararescue (http://www.pararescue.com/). They are among the few legit badasses of that branch of service (they and Combat Controllers, but you don't need air strikes unless you have planes, right?). The whole PJ mission revolves around saving downed friendlies behind enemy lines... really interesting job. Total respect for those guys. :cool:

[Cabbage Patch]

Air power remains the single most effective means of dropping a lot of explosives on a small spot quickly. My old rule-of-thumb was one pass by 2 fighters could put as much "steel on target" as 500 rounds of artillery. Imagine the impact of that on a zombie horde!

[Hellbringer]

Air power remains the single most effective means of dropping a lot of explosives on a small spot quickly. My old rule-of-thumb was one pass by 2 fighters could put as much "steel on target" as 500 rounds of artillery. Imagine the impact of that on a zombie horde!

You got me visualizing that scene in "We Were Soldiers" when LTC Moore shouted 'Broken Arrow' into the radio and all sorts of aircraft came in and dropped bombs and napalm on enemy positions. I guess napalm can stick to zombies, too.

[Osiris]

You got me visualizing that scene in "We Were Soldiers" when LTC Moore shouted 'Broken Arrow' into the radio and all sorts of aircraft came in and dropped bombs and napalm on enemy positions. I guess napalm can stick to zombies, too.

Why not? It sticks to little children well enough.

[Cabbage Patch]

You got me visualizing that scene in "We Were Soldiers" when LTC Moore shouted 'Broken Arrow' into the radio and all sorts of aircraft came in and dropped bombs and napalm on enemy positions. I guess napalm can stick to zombies, too.

Here's a link to a scene that's even more representative, from the original Starship Troopers Movie (first 30 seconds):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPp_8cqgXIU&feature=channel&list=UL

[Ryan]

I do think it was pretty crappy of Michael to try to guilt trip some of them into staying.
Definitely. Guilt/peer pressure is not a good basis for making a major, life altering decision. At the same time everyone dismissing enlistment was annoying. How long do they think civilization is going to last if every possible person doesn't stand up to fight this thing?

I'm glad Riley stayed at least. She might screw up from time to time but she always comes through in the end.

[Litmaster]

Here's a link to a scene that's even more representative, from the original Starship Troopers Movie (first 30 seconds)

Nice! I can totally picture zombies getting blown to bits likewise. But the guys mess up a bit at 2:55 with their tactics when they gun-herd all the beasties into a pile, surround them, then all start shooting towards the middle.

Not the smartest tactics in the world, IMHO...

[Bullethead]

Thoughts:
*Someone from the plane will be returning to the Fort.
*I find it troubling that the east coast had a full day to prepare and not one base survived. Also to previous posters points I'd like to know if any naval vessels made it out. However after this long they would be short on food and supplies right? Causing them to dock at somepoint and restock or risk starvation.
*Datu handing off his journal will be another chapter in its own such as Kolani's
*This base appears to have a ton of gasoline to be able to run generators (im assuming) to support a full command center (screens, computers, phones), training missions, etc. This leads me to wonder how many scouting missions they've run and how they could not know of things like the Towers / the Arena (especially after the explosion) / the Colony / the Mallers.
Final Thought:
*Michael is going to have to brief Kimmet on everything. Odds are he'll leave out a few details for his own reasons. But I wonder if Kimmet knows of the different types of "biters" that are out there and how the fort personell plan to deal with Bohemeths and such.

[Arkum]

I feel like there will either be a problem in the air and Pegs and company will have to take over and fly back, or Colorado isn't the lollipops and unicorns that it sounds so they need to escape!

My other thought was that CJ, Saul and Victor find their way to Fort Irwin and now that they are back with Tawnya, Michael and Riley, they go Rogue

[Cabbage Patch]

*This base appears to have a ton of gasoline to be able to run generators (im assuming) to support a full command center (screens, computers, phones), training missions, etc.

Powering the command center probably isn't a problem. Fort Irwin is the site of one of the larger solar electric power generation projects in the country, which provides for most of the base's electricity needs. It's also where a lot of the military's alternative energy projects get tested, like the electric power generators that run on garbage that went on to power some of the bases in the Middle East. Some of that hardware might be on hand.

Fuel for vehicles may be in short supply. We've heard Puck yell at people for "wasting gas" several times now.

[Bulldog711]

I apologize if someone else put this up......i stopped reading after page 10 on monday :)

What if the 3 shadowy figures are Tardust, Lizzy and BRICKS! ?????????

Last I checked weren't they left behind in the rubble of the Arena?

[nikvoodoo]

I apologize if someone else put this up......i stopped reading after page 10 on monday :)

What if the 3 shadowy figures are Tardust, Lizzy and BRICKS! ?????????

Last I checked weren't they left behind in the rubble of the Arena?

No. 2/3 of that grouping was last seen in the aftermath of Chapter 24 (post credit sequence). Lizzy wasn't there, but she had been present at the assault on the Tower. And without the ability to fly....it seems pretty unlikely that they are the three shadowy figures.

[raistlinsghost]

How is it that no one else has seen or dealt with the other kinds of zombies?

Now that both towers are gone and the mailers blew up the arena, the horde may move towards Fort Irwin. Maybe C. Kimmet will send out a scavenger party close to L.A. and they will get tailed back by a smart one.

I know that base is well equipped, but I don't know if they could survive a wave. Especially with the fast, jumper, smart and mammoth zombie types. Same goes for the colony.

What does Tanya's zombie bite mean for everyone?

Well, I think Puck will be locked up for observation.
Pegs, Datu and Kelly will be kicked off the plane at gun point. This will happen somewhere in the beginning of 29-3. In the cover art, you can see the plane taking off and the three figures to the right.

Mike and his crew will be all reevaluated and will have extra tests performed. Michael will finally get his arm x-rayed.

With all this happening, I thinks we will hear from tower CVS or from the mallers. This will lead us into chapter 30, which will fill us in with everything else that is going on in L.A.. I hope so. I don't want to be stuck at the base this whole time.

p.s. I ran in the "Run for your Lives," race in MA over the weekend. It was a blast! Unfortunately, I didn't survive. :mad: I will try again next year and will need that shirt posted on the forum, "Better Start Running." The race is coming to California in October.

Hey there. First time poster, long time fan. I just got caught up on this episode after spending the last few weeks listening to the whole series. I think its amazing and aside from a few 'what the hell' moments along the way, I've absolutely loved every minute of it. For this ep, I am glad to see Datu et al head off. We're meeting new characters and I am glad that we'll be spending time fleshing them out while we get a break from that group. I hope next ep sees the disclosure of everything that Michael has seen so he can get the attention of the CO. They need to understand how much the LA survivors have seen during their stay. I look forward to spending time with you all.

One last thing. I'm glad to hear someone from here has taken part in the Run for your lives event. I'm doing it myself in Toronto this fall and can't wait to act out my own version of We're Alive.

[Osiris]

Hey there. First time poster, long time fan. I just got caught up on this episode after spending the last few weeks listening to the whole series. I think its amazing and aside from a few 'what the hell' moments along the way, I've absolutely loved every minute of it. For this ep, I am glad to see Datu et al head off. We're meeting new characters and I am glad that we'll be spending time fleshing them out while we get a break from that group. I hope next ep sees the disclosure of everything that Michael has seen so he can get the attention of the CO. They need to understand how much the LA survivors have seen during their stay. I look forward to spending time with you all.

One last thing. I'm glad to hear someone from here has taken part in the Run for your lives event. I'm doing it myself in Toronto this fall and can't wait to act out my own version of We're Alive.

Good first post. Welcome, and don't forget to slide on over to the introductions thread (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?14-Introduce-Yourself%21&p=39841#post39841) and let us know a little bit about yourself! :D

[Britt]

Pegs is gone. We'll miss her, but she made her choice. Michael needs to start hanging out at Weed Army Community Hospital and get to know nurse Britt better. It sounds like she's a civilian after-all, so he doesn't have to deal with that whole rank-disparity thing.

BAHAHAHA. Okay, I'll have to start juggling Michael AND Pete.

[myltldmn]

Just listened to this Ep for about the 5th time, and I apologize if this is something already said, but does anyone else feel that Datu was a bit forceful about Michael needing to have his journal? More reveals from King Datu "The Resourceful"? Just a thought.

[GeneTwo]

Just listened to this Ep for about the 5th time, and I apologize if this is something already said, but does anyone else feel that Datu was a bit forceful about Michael needing to have his journal? More reveals from King Datu "The Resourceful"? Just a thought.

Datu wrote about how he put a couple of parachutes, found in Burt's other safe, on the roof of the WA tower. So Angel is alive after all!

[raistlinsghost]

Datu wrote about how he put a couple of parachutes, found in Burt's other safe, on the roof of the WA tower. So Angel is alive after all!

That's not bad. It will feel a bit like a retcon, but maybe that's because I assumed that there was no way Angel could have survived and so have written him off. I do agree after a re-listen, that Datu was a little too adamant that Michael get a look at his journal.

[Bullethead]

Im not sure if Datu was too adamant or forward. Datu is just Datu. He's a strange "doode" (Datu accent).

I mean I am sure there is something in there that will lead to good story later on but I am not as sure that Datu was with-holding vital information. Doesn't seem like he could keep a secret or tell a lie. Especially not to Micheal.

[Adventureless_Hero]

I felt the same in regards to Datu's Journal. Although I don't know if Michael is going to have an opportunity to read it himself or have someone else tasked with going over it (perhaps Cpl. Puck). I was thinking that perhaps the things he experienced at the Arena or what few notes Samantha jotted down might reveal some new information to a fresh set of eyes. Also, there is the possibility that Hope has something in her own back story that Datu learned in a conversation with her and he later wrote down in his own journal.

[Cabbage Patch]

Just listened to this Ep for about the 5th time, and I apologize if this is something already said, but does anyone else feel that Datu was a bit forceful about Michael needing to have his journal? More reveals from King Datu "The Resourceful"? Just a thought.

Datu's journal might be useful when Michael has his inevitable meeting with CJ. He can help establish goodwill by going over the Arena part, including the section that Samantha wrote. Then again, Saul and Victor would probably vouch for him, so never mind.

[HardKor]

I interpreted the whole Datu giving Michael his journal thing a little differently. I think the important part was the fact that Datu insisted that he was going to continue keeping a journal. It may have been a subtle hint that we haven't heard the last of the crew heading off for Boulder.

[Wingnut]

I looked and hadn't seen anybody mention this idea, so forgive me someone has and I missed it. I'm not sure if I buy in to the theory of Saul and Tanya having some genetic immunity to whatever is causing the zombie outbreak, but if they do I had a thought as to possibly why. Saul and Tanya are some of the few African American characters on the show, and the Sickle Cell trait, which is hereditary, is present in 1 in 500 African Americans. Generally, Sickle Cell is a bad thing, but it is actually provides protection against the parasite that causes malaria. Perhaps it could also afford some protection against to whatever is causing the zombie outbreak as well?

[nikvoodoo]

I looked and hadn't seen anybody mention this idea, so forgive me someone has and I missed it. I'm not sure if I buy in to the theory of Saul and Tanya having some genetic immunity to whatever is causing the zombie outbreak, but if they do I had a thought as to possibly why. Saul and Tanya are some of the few African American characters on the show, and the Sickle Cell trait, which is hereditary, is present in 1 in 500 African Americans. Generally, Sickle Cell is a bad thing, but it is actually provides protection against the parasite that causes malaria. Perhaps it could also afford some protection against to whatever is causing the zombie outbreak as well?


Hidey hi new guy....or gal....love the handle! ;)

This was brought up somewhere in the vast expanse of this forum at some point. Most likely in the Saul/Tanya Family immune thread (http://www.zombiepodcast.com/forum/showthread.php?1952-Saul-and-Tanya-Family-Immune), but it's definitely an interesting idea. If the killer cocktail of antibiotics pumping into Saul isn't the reason, it could be as plausible as any other reason why they are immune where others are not.

[Wingnut]

New guy. Long time listener, first time caller, etc. etc.

I'm leaning towards the drug theory as well. It works better for story telling because it gives the characters some hope of a "cure", which can then be used as a plot device to drive the story towards some sort of conclusion. Having it be something genetic that causes the immunity, while interesting, doesn't move the story along as much since it doesn't offer much of a hope for the rest of the remaining population.

[Devilish Pizza]

A theory just popped into my mind, and I'm in a rush, so can't check through the posts to see if someone has already posted this.....
I think that Tanya could have been bitten by the slow turner that she was experimenting on way back when. It could have happened at a time when she was the only person looking at him, and he went a bit rabid for a short time, and managed to bite her.
And when she said that she experimented some drugs on a slow turner, she could have meant herself, and found that some worked, but they were extremely limited in amount, so didn't mention it to anyone.
Any similar feelings?

[Osiris]

A theory just popped into my mind, and I'm in a rush, so can't check through the posts to see if someone has already posted this.....
I think that Tanya could have been bitten by the slow turner that she was experimenting on way back when. It could have happened at a time when she was the only person looking at him, and he went a bit rabid for a short time, and managed to bite her.
And when she said that she experimented some drugs on a slow turner, she could have meant herself, and found that some worked, but they were extremely limited in amount, so didn't mention it to anyone.
Any similar feelings?

VERY interesting thought! No, I'm not sure that has come up, but... +rep for one of the better theories I've read since burrito farts.

[Osiris]

Further proof that Kiwis > *

[Devilish Pizza]

Also, the Commander mentioned that all the land masses located on or near the ring of fire. If that's not just a coincidence (which, with KC it most likely won't be), then we here down in NZ would be beyond fucked! Seeing as our entire country is in the ring.

[Osiris]

Was nice reading your posts, bro. Best of luck.

[trubkir]

A theory just popped into my mind, and I'm in a rush, so can't check through the posts to see if someone has already posted this.....
I think that Tanya could have been bitten by the slow turner that she was experimenting on way back when. It could have happened at a time when she was the only person looking at him, and he went a bit rabid for a short time, and managed to bite her.
And when she said that she experimented some drugs on a slow turner, she could have meant herself, and found that some worked, but they were extremely limited in amount, so didn't mention it to anyone.
Any similar feelings?

Rabies has been brought up before but the whole experimented on herself angle is a new one for me. She could have been biten, realized she wasn't turning quickly but could feel the "effect" working. Vets get vaccinated for rabies and she probably made some hasty assumptions that since the disease has similar symptoms to rabies that she might be somewhat resistant. After deducing she had a time window she just started playing with the pharmaceuticals available and got the scavengers from the Colony to look for others she would be interested in trying.

Now that you got me thinking about this I realize that Rabies vaccines are basically dead rabies virus. Maybe she was taking blood from infected people and trying to isolate the active pathogen and finding something to kill it. The french guys who made the original Rabies vaccine in the late 1800's dried infected blood to kill the rabies virus (from Rabbits for all you non animal testers out there to protest). So maybe the drug cocktails weren't for immediate injection maybe she was culturing the pathogen and seeing what would kill it. This is another can of worms. Maybe the different types of zombies are actually caused by the mutations Tanya was causing. One more thing Tanya gave Saul antibiotics which would have no effect on the zombie virus as antibiotics are for fighting bacteria. I never heard the term antiviral with any of the drugs mentioned so far.

[Osiris]

Rabies has been brought up before but the whole experimented on herself angle is a new one for me. She could have been biten, realized she wasn't turning quickly but could feel the "effect" working. Vets get vaccinated for rabies and she probably made some hasty assumptions that since the disease has similar symptoms to rabies that she might be somewhat resistant. After deducing she had a time window she just started playing with the pharmaceuticals available and got the scavengers from the Colony to look for others she would be interested in trying.

Now that you got me thinking about this I realize that Rabies vaccines are basically dead rabies virus. Maybe she was taking blood from infected people and trying to isolate the active pathogen and finding something to kill it. The french guys who made the original Rabies vaccine in the late 1800's dried infected blood to kill the rabies virus (from Rabbits for all you non animal testers out there to protest). So maybe the drug cocktails weren't for immediate injection maybe she was culturing the pathogen and seeing what would kill it. This is another can of worms. Maybe the different types of zombies are actually caused by the mutations Tanya was causing. One more thing Tanya gave Saul antibiotics which would have no effect on the zombie virus as antibiotics are for fighting bacteria. I never heard the term antiviral with any of the drugs mentioned so far.

It seems that the context of rabid was more figurative than it was literal.

[Hellbringer]

It seems that the context of rabid was more figurative than it was literal.

I posted in the Tanya and Saul immunity thread that my crazy theory revolves around some sort of super anthrax. I bing'ed some images of people with anthrax and one can see how anthrax victims and zombies could look somewhat alike. It's not hard for me to start fathoming that the haze, the turning, and infection could be from some form of super anthrax that evolved from a primitive, prehistoric form of it and got trapped under the earth's surface for such a long time.
Rabies, anthrax... same thread of theory. Maybe. Ok, I'm grabbing at straws probably. Probably cattle-anthrax laced straw at that.

[trubkir]

Figuritive or literal the post got me thinking along the lines of drugs and cures. If the effect is caused by a virus then any and all anitbiotics are useless against it. If the effect is caused by bacteria like Hellbringers "Super Anthrax" then some sort of super antibiotic might work. I then thought what does experimenting on slow turners mean? If she is experimenting she has to be culturing samples from the affected people because that is the only reasonable way to analyze effects of drugs. If you just inject a person with a drug there are too many variables out of control to say whether the data collected is valid. There is something to be said for both Anthrax and Rabies. Anthrax is mostly spread by spores which are breathed in or ingested. Rabies is spread through direct contact mostly from the saliva of the biter to the blood of the bitten. We seem to have both these methods of infection plus numerous symptoms which appear to validate either hypothesis.

[Bullethead]

A further thought on Tanya,

I recall when she first joined the Tower she was more than interested in everyones journals. A moment occured when she was eager to tell Michael something. But he went super dick mode on her and she got fed up, left, and said "I will talk to you some other time".

Did we ever find out what it was that she wanted to tell him?

[nikvoodoo]

A further thought on Tanya,

I recall when she first joined the Tower she was more than interested in everyones journals. A moment occured when she was eager to tell Michael something. But he went super dick mode on her and she got fed up, left, and said "I will talk to you some other time".

Did we ever find out what it was that she wanted to tell him?

Nope. But if she's about to be put out to pasture from the Irwin-ites, I'd wager she's about to reveal more information about slow turners and finding ways to combat the infection.

Might be enough to spare her life....and keep her in a shock collar so she doesn't go too far.

[Adventureless_Hero]

Might be enough to spare he life....and keep her in a shock collar so she doesn't go too far.

lol! Pet zombies come to mind. Fido.

[nikvoodoo]

lol! Pet zombies come to mind. Fido.

Just keep the pet zombies away from Rex, Zombie Killer.

[Allie]

So I was reading some of the comments about how Michael was trying to guilt trip Pegs, Datu and the rest to stay with him.
But seriously remember how in the last few episodes Michael mentioned that he had grown to care about them more than he had his old unit back when he was in the Army? And remember their motto, 'no man left behind'. So Michael expected that if he had to stay, his group would rally around him and fight with him. Instead they decided to abandon him because: 'they got tired of fighting'.

So the world is overrrun by zombies and what do they decide to do? Go back to civilian life. Pegs will go grow flowers or whatever and kelly who knows what she'll do. Datu will abandon his friends who risked their life in a zombie infested territory to rescue him to take care of Hope who he barely just met. I mean where is the loyalty? For Pegs who said she cared about Michael but couldn't 'sacrifice her principles' to fight alongside with him but would do it if necessary back in the Colony. What kind of principles are those?

This episode really affected me because I thought the group had grown to be almost like a family and for them to just ditch Michael like that left me in Shock. Riley was always one of my favorite characters and now I know why. She's the only one that decided to stay with Michael which I think is awesome. And for those of you saying they had every right to leave Michael, think about this, would Lizzie have abandoned Saul if he decided to stay as well? No. She would have stayed and fought. Anyhow, just a small rant. So sad Michael is all alone. hopefully he gets reunited with Saul and Angel if they're still alive.

[Red Shirt]

We never learn what happens in happily ever after land unless the monster's carcass twitches (hinting to a sequel).


Rule #2: Double Tap. Always Double tap.



I've said it once and I'll say it again. The hows and whys might be revealed later, but the outbreak has some sort of geological origin. Can't say that it is exclusively fault lines, hot spots, volcanos or Digg Dugs but each of the places mentioned by the Colonel just ain't the most stable places in the world. Even the places such as Houston, Chicago and NY have geological.... stuff going on (Thanks RedShirt). This doesn't mean that the ground must be shaking and breaking Cecil B DeMille-Moses-dropping-the-10-Commandment-style. Just that there is some yet to be revealed connection. Again, there is something about Hawaii's Volcanos that made them 'nastier, meaner' than the one's in L.A.

You're welcome. My research into this has galvanized what I already knew... This Planet is a damn dangerous place to live. When you look at things from a perspective of the geological timescale, It is a miracle that anything has lived long enough to evolve into anything. Simply put, this planet is trying to kill us all off. The planet has damn near succeeded in the past (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extinction_event).

What I find even more frightening, though it doesn't (yet) keep me awake are the million(s) y/o bacteria that has been discovered in caves and the tens and hundreds million y/o bacteria that has been revived in the lab.

The Volcano/Fault Line disparity is a good point, though I think that could be the simple difference between cracks in the surface and actual 'holes' in the surface. If that is the case, Iceland (http://www.volcanodiscovery.com/iceland.html) and the Philippines (http://www.philippines.hvu.nl/volcanoes1.htm) are in big trouble. Sorry Datu.

Now, if it is indeed the difference between cracks and holes, then East Africa is in a massive world of hurt (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Rift_Valley). Not simply a fault line, the planet has actually split open here and the Horn of Africa is moving away from the main continent of Africa. Eventually a new ocean will form as the rift continues to widen, Much like the Mid-Atlantic Ridge.

Also of great concern, is the Yellowstone Caldera/Super Volcano (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellowstone_Caldera). Yellowstone is actively out-gassing volcanic fumes today, and would likely have been the first place that this happened.

As Burt would probably say, "Have fun sleeping tonight."


*for Non-Vets, "Autovon phone" refers to the government's secure telephone network, which was designed to survive a nuclear exchange. The official name changed to something else in the 80s, but we kept on calling them Autovon where I was stationed. The phones can be used to call any other phone on the network, worldwide, but only have a limited ability to connect to the civilian phone system.

That would be the DSN or Defense Switched Network (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_Switched_Network). All the capabilities of the AUTOVON (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autovon) and more. Much, much more.


Well, part three is out and I listened to it while writing here. I'm going to go checkout the storm that is surely (Shirley?) :D brewing there.

[Zombiphobe]

I thought the Michael/Pegs break-up scene was very well done. While listening to it, I could see the end coming and no way for either party to avoid it. Michael had to stay in Fort Irwin due to his military obligations, something Pegs couldn't seem to fathom. Pegs couldn't enlist, being extremely uncomfortable with guns, something Michael couldn't seem to fathom. They each wanted the other one to be with them, and yet couldn't understand why it was such an unreasonable request.

On the plus side, it gave me hope that the group would reunite again down the road. I was worried when Datu handed over his journal that it might be the last we hear from them, but I don't think the Michael/Pegs romance is over. I'm sure we will see her again, and hopefully others too.

[11B]

Thanks man! I was going crazy trying to remember what it was called. For some reason I kept thinking it started with a /T/. Curse you Mt. Tartarus!

Um, wtf? I keep trying to google map Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado to get an idea of how far it is from Boulder, but the fecking thing keeps showing Peterson AFB as being in Ohio? What the feck?

So anyway, North American Aerospace Defense Command appears to be near Colorado Springs, Colorado. A mere 100 miles south of Boulder. I wonder if there is anything there?


http://maps.google.com/maps?q=norad&hl=en&sll=33.701572,-117.822351&sspn=0.108537,0.141792&t=w&hq=norad&radius=15000&z=13

and

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheyenne_Mountain

In case no one answered it in the previous 300 pages.

[Red Shirt]

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=norad&hl=en&sll=33.701572,-117.822351&sspn=0.108537,0.141792&t=w&hq=norad&radius=15000&z=13

Bad map location. Try this one. (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Cheyenne+Mountain+Air+Force+Station,+Colorado+Sp rings,+CO&aq=&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=40.409448,86.572266&vpsrc=0&t=h&ie=UTF8&hq=Cheyenne+Mountain+Air+Force+Station,&hnear=Colorado+Springs,+El+Paso,+Colorado&z=11)