"Zombie" Virus

[lkiam]

I remember in the live Q&A last year a question was asked about the "virus" and if it could mutate. Shane avoided answering but it seems to me like it can. At the beginning of the story, the zombies seemed like the ones in movies, unintelligent and instinct driven, but as the story progressed, they became smarter, and more varied. There were no behemoths, runners, jumpers etc. at the start, so where did they all come from?

[Luna Guardian]

In all honesty, it's very likely that the Behemoths, Runners, Jumpers, Smart Ones etc. were there since the beginning. Remember that LA is a big place, even if there were hundreds they could be easily missed in the panic, confusion and chaos that marked the beginning of humanity's end. Add to that that Runners, Smart Ones and Little Ones look like normals (at least that's how I picture them), and that Jumpers probably were jumping from rooftops to apartments, it's very likely that they were just missed as no one paid any attention to which type of horror monster was eating their family and friends.

[COsurvivor]

I thought they said it depended upon the person... The virus did not mutate as have a different reaction to different people.

[Icarus]

I thought they said it depended upon the person... The virus did not mutate as have a different reaction to different people.
This is what I thought. I remember them referencing that the smart ones were previously smart as people and that it carried over once they mutated. I don't think much detail has been given about why each particular zombie is what it is (behemoth, little one, etc...) but at the Q&A it was said that the why will be revealed (although not when it will be revealed).

[Canadianfan]

I think that the virus is mutating, as the "food supply" or humans starts drying up, then it will be the zombies that can do other things (ie Paul) that won't die out as quickly. Remember Skittles said that he believed the "jumpers" (I think) had died out. I also can stop thinking that these "little ones" are really just infected kids.

[Teethingbiscuit]

I like the idea of a microbe of some sort. It would be all domineering, in order to fight off mass decay and keep rigor from setting in, and possibly even keeping the host well, alive.
Teeth

[timberwoof]

Has anything ever been said if these things have a heart beat of some kind?

[COsurvivor]

I hope it is not like a 28 Days Later deal...

[Luna Guardian]

In the first episode they said that "Headshots seem to drop them like stones" and before that, they were not stopping. I think it's safe to assume that they don't have a heartbeat

[shadow]

that would also explain, why at the beginning of chapter 11 or the end of chapter 10 when Burt shot "Paul" with 2 in the chest he didnt die. But i have a question, If they dont have heartbeats, how can they feel pain? Because again when burt makes the 300 meter shot, we can clearly hear "Paul" roar in pain. just a thought

[kafu288]

I think that's just Paul. Remember while they were heading towards teh arena Riley pierced one of them through the leg with an arrow and it just kept walking. I think only the very smart ones can feel pain.

[Luna Guardian]

You might also be reading too much into it. Remember that vampires don't have blood circulation, thus can't get erections and they're still representing sexuality. It doesn't ALL have to make sense.

[wooly]

We have enough story clues to determine that the creatures (1) breathe (2) have brain function (3) have some degree of functional circulation, implying a beating heart (4) retain some of the same metabolic functions as humans

Michael's anesthesia experiments during the GPS tagging confirm all of the above. For gas anesthesia to work you have to breathe it in, transfer it to circulation via gas exchange in the lungs, transfer the drug to the brain & body via the circulation. The creatures rapidly adapted to the drug which indicates some hepatic or renal function (again proving circulation as a corollary) as drugs are typically metabolized and excreted via a combination of those two systems.

Therefore, the creatures are not "zombies" in the traditional dead sense of the word. They are alive in some sense, just not normal humans.

This works from a physiology standpoint. Does it work according to the rules of Kc's universe? I think so. It's right there in the story.

Or have I got it all wrong?

[MrScott101]

Wooly I believe you nailed it, plus there is a discussion as to whether the zombies have a heat index which would also support fluid circulation.

[nikvoodoo]

We have enough story clues to determine that the creatures (1) breathe (2) have brain function (3) have some degree of functional circulation, implying a beating heart (4) retain some of the same metabolic functions as humans

Michael's anesthesia experiments during the GPS tagging confirm all of the above. For gas anesthesia to work you have to breathe it in, transfer it to circulation via gas exchange in the lungs, transfer the drug to the brain & body via the circulation. The creatures rapidly adapted to the drug which indicates some hepatic or renal function (again proving circulation as a corollary) as drugs are typically metabolized and excreted via a combination of those two systems.

Therefore, the creatures are not "zombies" in the traditional dead sense of the word. They are alive in some sense, just not normal humans.

This works from a physiology standpoint. Does it work according to the rules of Kc's universe? I think so. It's right there in the story.

Or have I got it all wrong?

You've got it all entirely wrong!.....

.....now if I can just find where you got it all entirely wrong I will gladly let you know.... ;) Great job piecing together the clues. I think this is the most coherent analysis of the zombies "status" I've seen on here.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

We have enough story clues to determine that the creatures (1) breathe (2) have brain function (3) have some degree of functional circulation, implying a beating heart (4) retain some of the same metabolic functions as humans

Michael's anesthesia experiments during the GPS tagging confirm all of the above. For gas anesthesia to work you have to breathe it in, transfer it to circulation via gas exchange in the lungs, transfer the drug to the brain & body via the circulation. The creatures rapidly adapted to the drug which indicates some hepatic or renal function (again proving circulation as a corollary) as drugs are typically metabolized and excreted via a combination of those two systems.

Therefore, the creatures are not "zombies" in the traditional dead sense of the word. They are alive in some sense, just not normal humans.

This works from a physiology standpoint. Does it work according to the rules of Kc's universe? I think so. It's right there in the story.

Or have I got it all wrong?

Wooly... you ROCK! That was an outstanding post! Hoorahh!

[Luna Guardian]

If Wooly's theory is correct (as it very well seems to be, good job!), doesn't that mean that nerve agents and other poisons could be deployed against the zombies?

[nikvoodoo]

If Wooly's theory is correct (as it very well seems to be, good job!), doesn't that mean that nerve agents and other poisons could be deployed against the zombies?

It could, but it would be rendered ineffective after one or two uses. Much like with the chloroform, they would (in theory) build an immunity to it shortly after.

[Luna Guardian]

It could, but it would be rendered ineffective after one or two uses. Much like with the chloroform, they would (in theory) build an immunity to it shortly after.
Only if they survive. You need to be alive to develope an immunity, and if the nerve agent/poison is effective, the targets would be killed. It would of course have to be powerful enough to kill them before they developed an immunity

[Mugwump]

I cant actually remember any of the Zombies being " re-animated " so to speak. People are either ripped apart and eaten or they get infected and change. Cant recall anyone coming back from the dead. In theory, if its an infection then a cure could be found.

[timberwoof]

Nice Analysis Wooly. Good job man.

[Pikepaw]

As Saul said in Chapter 1, "Who said they were dead?"

I think they are like 28 Days Later infected, in that they are still alive but have a disease. Also in Chapter 3, Saul points out that some people are killed (and eaten) while others are turned and wonders how the Zed's choose.
While head-shots are most effective, there is evidence that at least certain types of zombies will die from damage to the center mass. In 12-4, Burt kills the Jumper with a shotgun blast to its chest and in 13-2, -3 he uses a SAW on the mass horde surrounding the firetruck. No way he was getting all head shots with that. The last one I can think of is in 7-3, where Lizzie describes Michael and Saul as blowing holes in the two zeds that had come onto the roof. I think one bullet to the head will drop them, but cause enough damage to the center mass and they will go down. This I think points to some kind of parasite or microbe or something controlling the body, in that it can make them tougher but enough damage will take them down.

Also, the Behemoths have something special that no other zombie has, with their thick hides and they don't need their frontal lobes (how the one in 10-3 survived Riley's arrow). However, Kalani was able to slay two by shooting them in the mouth. They still must have a soft pallette and the roof of the mouth would be much closer to the center cortex of the brain than going through the eye. The brain-stem part (I'm currently blanking on a lot of the scientific terms, forgive me) of the brain is the area most zombie experts agree needs to be destroyed, since it runs the body functions. That is my explanation for why Kalani could shoot Behemoth's dead through the mouth when Riley's arrow failed

[nikvoodoo]

Also, the Behemoths have something special that no other zombie has, with their thick hides and they don't need their frontal lobes (how the one in 10-3 survived Riley's arrow). However, Kalani was able to slay two by shooting them in the mouth. They still must have a soft pallette and the roof of the mouth would be much closer to the center cortex of the brain than going through the eye. The brain-stem part (I'm currently blanking on a lot of the scientific terms, forgive me) of the brain is the area most zombie experts agree needs to be destroyed, since it runs the body functions. That is my explanation for why Kalani could shoot Behemoth's dead through the mouth when Riley's arrow failed

I'm pretty sure Riley shot that one in the eye, which doesn't guarantee it made it to that behemoth's brain. The penetration power of a bolt vs. a bullet is pretty drastic (I base this off years of watching Mythbusters). As of now, there's not evidence that shooting a behemoth in the head isn't effective. When Angel and Kalani tried, the behemoth blocked its face and they didn't get a clean shot at it.

[COsurvivor]

GREAT! Thinking Dead Heads...

[Luna Guardian]

This I think points to some kind of parasite or microbe or something controlling the body, in that it can make them tougher but enough damage will take them down.

So kinda like the Necromorphs in Dead Space, though slightly different?

[fairyfartz]

Bear with me, I don't quite know how to say what I'm trying to say.
I think Skittles has a lot of answers. I think the trauma and inability to cope coupled with isolation and fear of being held accountable simply for knowing or being a part of what happened is why he acts as jittery as he does. (Does that sentence even make sense?)
He is the one who explained about the different types of zombies. How does he know this? Yes it's possible he knows from observation and survival but does he really seem clear enough? He was simply being evasive so they wouldn't catch on that he knew more than he should. It seems like if they would have asked the right questions or paid a bit more attention they might have. I think Angel is dismissing him as being a bit touched. I hate to say this, but I think if Michael had been the one interacting with Skittles he woulda figured it out or trailed him for a while to pick his brain. I'm not knocking Angel at all it's just that his and Michaels brains work differently. If Michael does get the chance to meet Skittles or talks with Angel about him, they'll figure out he knows more and make an effort to seek him out. That's when we'll learn more about what happened to cause all this. Or at least point them in the direction of where to go to get answers.

I really hope this makes sense or at least gives you an idea of where I'm trying to go and why. Give me a little time to go back over the episodes I'm thinking of and gather my thoughts more coherently. Or for pete's sake if you get it and can clear it up go ahead.