Article: Tower-gate

[Ra1th]

You can view the page at http://zombiepodcast.com/forum/content.php?152-Tower-gate

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

What if it was non of the above? What if it turned out to be character that we learn about in hindsight or his/her journal?
My theory is that it's the guy who died trying to sneak out on his own.

[nikvoodoo]

I subscribe to the theory that having a dead person being the traitor isn't as interesting storytelling wise.

[Ra1th]

I'm betting that it wont be a non-major character or a dead character because of story telling. It just seems like a cheap way out. Theres a lot of tension brewing and building up over the last season over who the mole is. Kc will almost surely seize the opportunity and end it with a bang rather than a fizzle.

Think of it this way, if we see three people playing Russian roulette, then we expect that one of those 3 people will die, and there is tension over who will die, if no one dies at the end, it just seems cheap, like wow, what was the point of this whole thing.

But honestly I wouldn't mind if the traitor turned out to be none of the major tower residents. I've grown attached to a lot of them (some more than others) and it would suck if like Angel or Riley turned out to be the culprit

[Th3_T3ch]

If I'm not mistaken Datu was sick before and during the war. Being in the arena took quite a toll on him and he was in shock, then eventually he gets better, but we don't find out until season two that he made a full recovery. My bet is that Datu isn't the traitor.

[Ra1th]

If I'm not mistaken Datu was sick before and during the war. Being in the arena took quite a toll on him and he was in shock, then eventually he gets better, but we don't find out until season two that he made a full recovery. My bet is that Datu isn't the traitor.

We know that Datu was not responding to tower crew's questions immediately after he was rescued. After that, we know that during the party, he was not talking to anyone in the tower. But what's crucial here is that during the fire, Datu was up and walking on his own, he filled up gas canisters with diesel from the generator with ease, he was also leading some tower residents in prayer, and we know he had some loud arguments with Michael and Burt, so we know for a fact that datu was capable of moving around and that he was capable of talking, arguing, and yelling by the time of the war. During the party, Datu's is "believed" to be in his room, sulking, we don't know that for a fact. Everyone is at the party. The only people who arent, are Tommy, and Datu. Tommy was downstairs keeping guard, and Datu was supposedly in his room, but no one actually checked. So at the end of the day, Datu is definitely "capable" of having committed the crime.

but of course the point of the article was never to find the traitor, just to narrow down the search, and point out who is obviously not the traitor. I've basically laid down a number of facts in front of you, who you believe to be the traitor is your choice.

[HaveCrowBarWillTravel]

What I feel everyone is missing is that the traitor had to have mulitiple conversations (or talked during one really long night shift) with the mallers in order to pass on such detailed info about everyone and the tower..ie the camera locations.
My theory about the traitor being a "Red Shirt" being the traitor... I think it can be told and made interesting in a few different ways. Via his journal entries and told in the first person (like Samatha's story). They can find stuff in his room about other plans or any number of interesting things about the Mallers.
Let's just say they stumble across information about Durai's past or information about Scratch and Angel's connection...
The actual motivation for the visit then attack starts to flesh out and the traitor becomes a not so important issue because they find out so much more. The possibilities are endless.

[nikvoodoo]

Let's consider the information passed to the Mallers:

1. The Tower was having a party.
2. Names and positions within the Tower (either 25-30 people, or just the command structure....and honestly it was just the command structure because they didn't know who Pegs was.)
3. Michael's broken arm
4. Lack of Ammo

That's really all the information that was seemingly given up. There's no mention of any other information by Durai or Scratch....that's honestly not a whole lot. And if the mole hopped on the radio really quick, found the mallers and said "Just listen and don't respond, I don't have much time" the conversation could be over in 5 minutes.

You still haven't convinced me that it was a Red Shirt Crowbar, but it is an interesting point about the conflict coming in the form of Angel/Scratch's history. I still just think that's not nearly as much bang for the buck as they say. The biggest bang comes from trusting a character, and then realizing they are the betrayer of the Tower, in my opinion.

[2-4-5 Trioxin]

I haven't really thought about who the traitor is, but I just realized something once I red this...and it's about Kalani...Ok so we don't know much about him. And then there's the stated theory that he may be connected to the mallers but ended up being captured & placed in the arena...so check it out...and if it's already been posted, sorry about that...

1) when he was at the other tower, it fell apart within 3 days he was there...he says they were attacked by the "zombies" but if you think about it, if he contacted the mallers to take over, they would've attracted the "zombies" with the noise they would bring...3 days is more than enough time to case the place out & get info to the mallers...

2) now when he got to the "main" tower after being rescued, it was roughly 2 days before it fell apart...and remember once Michael, Angel & Saul were done de-breifing him, Angel told Kalani that he was going to be doing guard duty the following day, which gave him access to the radio...I also thought that in chap.16, Angel was testing him to see if he knew what channel the mallers used when they were dropping off Latch's body...He says he didn't know, but you never know...

Anyway, that's my thought on another possibility that Kalani may be the culprit. But only KC knows who it is...

[nikvoodoo]

I haven't really thought about who the traitor is, but I just realized something once I red this...and it's about Kalani...Ok so we don't know much about him. And then there's the stated theory that he may be connected to the mallers but ended up being captured & placed in the arena...so check it out...and if it's already been posted, sorry about that...

1) when he was at the other tower, it fell apart within 3 days he was there...he says they were attacked by the "zombies" but if you think about it, if he contacted the mallers to take over, they would've attracted the "zombies" with the noise they would bring...3 days is more than enough time to case the place out & get info to the mallers...

2) now when he got to the "main" tower after being rescued, it was roughly 2 days before it fell apart...and remember once Michael, Angel & Saul were done de-breifing him, Angel told Kalani that he was going to be doing guard duty the following day, which gave him access to the radio...I also thought that in chap.16, Angel was testing him to see if he knew what channel the mallers used when they were dropping off Latch's body...He says he didn't know, but you never know...

Anyway, that's my thought on another possibility that Kalani may be the culprit. But only KC knows who it is...

the only issue I take with your theory (which is interesting by the by) is that if Kalani had sold out the other Tower upon his arrival to the Mallers, then why are they still located in the strip mall? The other tower seems to have become devoid of human life and thus would be prime pickings to rebuild the defenses vs taking over an entirely fortified target (Our Tower).

[Ra1th]

What I feel everyone is missing is that the traitor had to have mulitiple conversations (or talked during one really long night shift) with the mallers in order to pass on such detailed info about everyone and the tower..ie the camera locations.
My theory about the traitor being a "Red Shirt" being the traitor... I think it can be told and made interesting in a few different ways. Via his journal entries and told in the first person (like Samatha's story). They can find stuff in his room about other plans or any number of interesting things about the Mallers.
Let's just say they stumble across information about Durai's past or information about Scratch and Angel's connection...
The actual motivation for the visit then attack starts to flesh out and the traitor becomes a not so important issue because they find out so much more. The possibilities are endless.

It's possible for the culprit to be a red shirt. But i think it would be really difficult to introduce a new character this late in the game. Especially after our recent influx of tanya, victor, hope, marcus, and gatekeeper (is it leader now?) all these characters minus gatekeeper and marcus, need to be fleshed out, i think it would be more difficult to bring in a new character for the sole purpose of being the traitor. But then again, i was dead certain that MPK wouldn't be able to escape the colony, and yet Kc pulled it off well. And since the point of the article was never to figure out who did it, rather figure out who didnt, I'd prly give a Possible rating for the redshirt theory.

[Th3_T3ch]

I haven't really thought about who the traitor is, but I just realized something once I red this...and it's about Kalani...Ok so we don't know much about him. And then there's the stated theory that he may be connected to the mallers but ended up being captured & placed in the arena...so check it out...and if it's already been posted, sorry about that...

1) when he was at the other tower, it fell apart within 3 days he was there...he says they were attacked by the "zombies" but if you think about it, if he contacted the mallers to take over, they would've attracted the "zombies" with the noise they would bring...3 days is more than enough time to case the place out & get info to the mallers...

2) now when he got to the "main" tower after being rescued, it was roughly 2 days before it fell apart...and remember once Michael, Angel & Saul were done de-breifing him, Angel told Kalani that he was going to be doing guard duty the following day, which gave him access to the radio...I also thought that in chap.16, Angel was testing him to see if he knew what channel the mallers used when they were dropping off Latch's body...He says he didn't know, but you never know...

Anyway, that's my thought on another possibility that Kalani may be the culprit. But only KC knows who it is...

If you remember from Chapter 19-1 we are given a first-hand account about how the other tower fell, i.e. hope. Hope explains how she got out of the tower by jumping out a three story window, that seems fishy to me, to avoid being eaten by a flesh-biter.

[Ra1th]

If you remember from Chapter 19-1 we are given a first-hand account about how the other tower fell, i.e. hope. Hope explains how she got out of the tower by jumping out a three story window, that seems fishy to me, to avoid being eaten by a flesh-biter.

i think its just luck and coincidence, when she jumped out the window, she wasnt blind, she hit the floor hard, prly what caused the blindness, and at the bottom, sean was waiting for her, and was able to save her life, crazier things have happened. Survival of the fittest is one part of surviving, the other is just plain luck. And from everythign we've heard it's prly a zombie attack that felled the second tower, not a maller hit

[Th3_T3ch]

I have already given my theory about Kalani on a multiple of different threads, so I'm not going to hash it out here, again. Kalani is capable of being the rat. Hope tells Michael how the zombies were in the other tower, that takes some suspision away from Kalani. For all we know Kalani could just have some really crappy luck. I personally don't believe that. Again why would the mallers, if they actually took the other tower, want the tower? It doesn't make sense because Durai said he wanted a safer place to live. So to recap, Kalani a major possibility. Datu, I still believe to be innocent. He was still sick during the party.

[Dr Janus]

Been a while so my memory is a bit faded.. But who was the guy that went out alone earlier in the story... Doing a little maller recon mission all by himself ?... Saul right ? They could have met up for tea and crumpets for all we know. Seems pretty gung ho for some dude, be it a hardened Ramboesque soldier to go running off into the netherworlds of zombie infestation to tackle some unknown hostile force alone... zom:(

[Yoyo]

Been a while so my memory is a bit faded.. But who was the guy that went out alone earlier in the story... Doing a little maller recon mission all by himself ?... Saul right ? They could have met up for tea and crumpets for all we know. Seems pretty gung ho for some dude, be it a hardened Ramboesque soldier to go running off into the netherworlds of zombie infestation to tackle some unknown hostile force alone... zom:(

Why would they be shooting him though a faint (almost impossible) possibility that he made the deal when he was in the hybrid.

Other than that, I think anyone in the security room when the shot was fired into the mallers cannot be the traitor or at least working alone. That would be pegs, michael, Burt, Angel, and Tommy. Other than that, Bill was the only one with a key to unlock the Datu Keybox to get Burt's stuff. I would find it unreasonable to have Bill be framed as to have someone go into his apartment and steal his unknown key. Unless, someone took it from him when he was ill but I still find that unlikely as I doubt anyone could have reasonably guess what key would be what.

The way I see it, I think Latch was lying about following Saul to the Tower as they were being attacked by them and I would think he would have made a clean getaway. I'm thinking she had connections beforehand to the tower with Bill. I could be wrong but I see no one else (aside from a red shirt) that would give up the tower except for Bill. Its the connection with Scratch however, is pure conjecture and I can't really prove it to be so.

[timberwoof]

Has anybody thought there may have been two traitors and not just one? I'm leaning to possibly a double team of kellie and Tommy. Come on I know they helped out and all but there was ample opportunity for them to scout out, use the radio and fire the shot. Doesn't have to be just one person. Right?

[yarri]

Has anybody thought there may have been two traitors and not just one? I'm leaning to possibly a double team of kellie and Tommy. Come on I know they helped out and all but there was ample opportunity for them to scout out, use the radio and fire the shot. Doesn't have to be just one person. Right?


TimberWoof. My money is and has always been on Tommy being the traitor.. I say this in a whisper cause Ra1th might smack me around..

[Yoyo]

TimberWoof. My money is and has always been on Tommy being the traitor.. I say this in a whisper cause Ra1th might smack me around..

What makes you think that? I mean Tommy was the one that wanted to stay on the lower floor to help out. I mean he set up cameras under the fire of mallers. Then again, he would be the perfect one to have talked to them with the CB radio along with him knowing about the elevators and having access to Riley's store. IN this case, he's a perfect traitor as much as Bill is (aside from not open pack of cheetos like him) and its scary to think about it that way. Only problem I have with this theory is that who would be why would he work with Bill?

I mean he still would need to go to Bill to get the key to take the gun ammo and Bill had to at least know what Tommy was doing to take some of the cheetos from the hidden stash. Overall, it would fit the two people theory as Bill could be the one that shot at the Mallers and Tommy was the only one sober along with being in the Guard room to use the CB radio. ACTUALLY, shouldn't Tommy know who came to use the CB radio in the time the party going on? Then again, it could be before the party actually commenced that the message went out to come later that night.

In the end, a Bill and Tommy combo looks good with maybe Kelly involved as a third party as I doubt she wouldn't know about the betrayal. Yet, Bill could have just horded stuff and the second traitor operated independantly on the opening Bill created. It still wouldn't account for the gunshot if Tommy was a Traitor and being stuck in the guard room. Maybe the mallers lied about being shot at but I'm pretty sure it was independantly confirmed by the tower that a shot did go off. In any case, it does leave a two traitor option in Tommy and maybe Kelly with Bill being a theif. I would narrow it down to those three unless a red shirt shows up.

[The Chosen One]

Been a while so my memory is a bit faded.. But who was the guy that went out alone earlier in the story... Doing a little maller recon mission all by himself ?... Saul right ? They could have met up for tea and crumpets for all we know. Seems pretty gung ho for some dude, be it a hardened Ramboesque soldier to go running off into the netherworlds of zombie infestation to tackle some unknown hostile force alone... zom:(

To add a little more to this...
If you guys remember, Saul also went to jail for a year. I think a year is more than enough time to join a gang. It is entirely possible that Saul could've been fired upon by accident, and, as Saul and Scratch were having a gunfight at close range, with automatic weapons firing down at him, I find it highly unlikely that he could have escaped unscathed, let alone without killing scratch.
And when he came back... He didn't seem tired, he actually sounded rather relieved and happy. I can't imagine a miraculous escape like his could leave a person in such a state as his was when he came back.
And finally, Saul wasn't in the room when the shots where fired, and he only had one shot in his gun when he killed the 1 man Maller scouting party during the war. And before someone calls me on the friendly fire with the molotov, do consider the guys he killed were destroying a crucial feature of the Tower, a feature that the Mallers could want, and I dont think he could exactly shout down and tell them to stop...

He seems really fishy to me. I guess we will find out soon, because Lizzie got captured and is apparently being taken to Scratch. We can only see what Saul will do when he is out in the field looking for her, as the latest episode seems to indicate he will be doing.

[Yoyo]

Looks like Saul can't be the Traitor in that he wants to kill all the Mallers in the last episode of chapter 20. Does that peg him at 0 percent?

[Ra1th]

Looks like Saul can't be the Traitor in that he wants to kill all the Mallers in the last episode of chapter 20. Does that peg him at 0 percent?

I thought about it and he wants to kill all the mallers to get his girlfriend back, but the mallers seem like a mixed bunch, some much worse than others, it's possibly arguable that saul cut a deal with them, and maybe he regrets it now? or the mallers screwed him over. At the end of the day there's no real evidence supporting it, but at the same time, i feel like when i give a 0% rating, I want to be absolutely sure that there is no chance, that that person could be the traitor. Pegs is the only one who'll get that rating in my book. Saul has the next best thing though, next to 0 is a damn good score, and the latest set of events just add to him probably being innocent

[canadawolf2002]

i really hope the traitor is not kelly or reilly as they are my favourite characters. I see them as being extremely heroic in that they dont give up, even if they disagree with the others they still stand to the task of protecting them.

[Poddy mckeown]

I noticed that in the votes saul had a surprising number of votes he is one of the last people i would expect to betray the tower:(

[Poddy mckeown]

In my opinion bill is the most likely person who would betray the tower. he stole all the weapons to weaken the tower Burt and micheal defended him by saying 'he fought along side us to the bitter end' but burt didnt fire a shot and his last words were im sorry.;)

[Ra1th]

In my opinion bill is the most likely person who would betray the tower. he stole all the weapons to weaken the tower Burt and micheal defended him by saying 'he fought along side us to the bitter end' but burt didnt fire a shot and his last words were im sorry.;)

that apology could easily have been because he stole the weapons, ammo and supplies.

Give me a motive, that's what it came down to for my decision, I looked and looked, and it didnt seem as though Bill had anything to gain by inviting in the mallers.

[COsurvivor]

I have recently gone through Season 1, as I recently purchase the CD set ( I LOVE IT!), that aside I think I would like to change my vote from Kalani...

Kalani is "TOO OBVIOUS" sure he is a brown noser and an "outsider" and has come from the other tower that was stronger and better led. But, after listening to all of Season one and Season 2, I feel Kelly is the the most likely of them all.

Kelly brought her nephew with her and was so quick to kick him to the curb. Sure she is a lawyer, but that means nothing now, well not enough to finger her. But, she has on a few occasions looked to her own self when the wind blew into a bad situation.

Sure she has backed up Michael here and there, but didn't Benedict Arnold back up George Washington up to the point of setting him up for capture? Unless this conspiracy is coming from "Left Field" Kelly is our Lee Harvey Oswald here...

[nikvoodoo]

I have recently gone through Season 1, as I recently purchase the CD set ( I LOVE IT!), that aside I think I would like to change my vote from Kalani...

Kalani is "TOO OBVIOUS" sure he is a brown noser and an "outsider" and has come from the other tower that was stronger and better led. But, after listening to all of Season one and Season 2, I feel Kelly is the the most likely of them all.

Kelly brought her nephew with her and was so quick to kick him to the curb. Sure she is a lawyer, but that means nothing now, well not enough to finger her. But, she has on a few occasions looked to her own self when the wind blew into a bad situation.

Sure she has backed up Michael here and there, but didn't Benedict Arnold back up George Washington up to the point of setting him up for capture? Unless this conspiracy is coming from "Left Field" Kelly is our Lee Harvey Oswald here...
To me, Kalani and Kelly were both too obvious which is why I have stood by the least obvious person (who is still capable of being a rat) ever, Datu.

[Bulldog711]

Datu is a lil sketchy.....very neurotic and will cling onto anything that will keep him safe.....its a wise choice I say